Empire jumping, spying and cloakers. - PlanetSide Universe
PSU Social Facebook Twitter Twitter YouTube Steam TwitchTV
PlanetSide Universe
PSU: Come on, try it, all the cool kids are doing it.
Home Forum Chat Wiki Social AGN PS2 Stats
Notices
Go Back   PlanetSide Universe > PlanetSide Discussions > PlanetSide 2 Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 2012-04-27, 09:57 AM   [Ignore Me] #1
Snipefrag
Contributor
First Lieutenant
 
Snipefrag's Avatar
 
Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Hi All,

I've got a couple of points to raise in this thread, first of all is to voice a concern that's been growing in my mind. I thought it would be a good idea to throw it out into the community and see if its shared, if the devs have put thought into tackling it and to see if the community can come up with some ideas to combat it. The second part is a gameplay mechanic which I think would add an exciting and (up to now) unexplored new angle to PS2.

First of all I am slightly concerned about the mission system as it stands, its a great concept.. Incentivising team work and giving commander the tools to direct the flow of battle, it will surely provide a enjoyable meta game. But as things stand I can see 'spying' being a big problem, with the game being free to play there is absolutely nothing stopping people (especially commanders) having two instances of the game open and then directly countering missions that might have been set by the opposition. Imagine if in the second world war all alliance and axis strategy was broadcast directly to the opposition.. There's a good chance it would still be going on today. Obviously there are things commanders can do to try and combat this like in the original game.. Such as withholding target information for as long as possible, but I still think this will have a negative effect on gameplay.

So what can be done about it? I really don't know, you cant lock people down to 1 connection per i.p. for obvious reasons. You can limit it to one instance of the game per PC.. but I doubt people will double box PS. Any ideas?

The gameplay mechanic that I think might have some legs is the ability for infiltrators who have dedicated a lot of time into cloaky infil related activities getting the ability to hack out Intel about the opposite faction.. Such as what missions are currently on that continent, current enemy locations as an overlay, all of which can be shared with the entire faction via an Intel overlay on the map. It would have to be hard to achieve to get data like this, maybe even involve some sort of hacking minigame like Deux ex in the oppositions main control room/CC. Obviously if someone can just log onto a second account and find out this information easily then there is no point in even considering putting development effort into this.
Snipefrag is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 10:09 AM   [Ignore Me] #2
Garem
Sergeant
 
Garem's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


I play a different game where a FAR less significant boost is gained at a MUCH higher price for multiaccounting. People do it. It's impossible to stop, and there are lots of grey areas.

If people go through the trouble of spying for this nominal amount of information, so be it. Let them. The cost of fixing it would most certainly outweigh the benefit of removing it. Adding a pricetag to PS2, at this point, is out of the question. So if people will cheat, and they will, at least they can cheat equally without regard to who can spend the most money.

Hell. Why not just undermine the "spying" in the first place- let EVERYONE have access to see what missions the other sides are doing. Your infiltrator idea is a great way to go about it, adding an element of action to it if just plainly offering the information isn't a good enough way to go about it.
__________________
Staff Writer at Terran-Republic.com
M&B:Warband - Strategus Clan: Fallen Brigade
Garem is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 10:18 AM   [Ignore Me] #3
Rbstr
Contributor
Lieutenant General
 
Rbstr's Avatar
 
Misc Info
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


I continue to fail to see why spying is such a big deal. People pay money to do it in EVE and others. Plus the game is so transient anyway.

The important empire-switching issue is that people will be more free to jump ship and join the "winning team" without some kind of disincentive.
__________________

All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others.
Rbstr is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 10:23 AM   [Ignore Me] #4
onwee
Sergeant
 
onwee's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Spying will happen no matter what systems they implement. People want a competitive edge, just like wars in real life. Many people will spend real money and take months planting themselves into other outfits.

The best thing you can do is hold down the trigger and spin in circles, killing everybody.
onwee is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 10:29 AM   [Ignore Me] #5
EVILPIG
Contributor
Colonel
 
EVILPIG's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Good outfits do not fear spies.
__________________
"That which does not kill us,
makes us stronger
" -Nietzsche

www.planetside-devildogs.com
EVILPIG is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 10:32 AM   [Ignore Me] #6
Bromaxulon
Private
 
Bromaxulon's Avatar
 


I agree with most of the replies here. Sure people would Spy to gain an advantage, but good luck trying to get the rest of your empire to act on that info. From what I have experienced in ps1, trying to coordinate your side with multiple outfits and soloers is akin to having an argument with a brick wall. You can yell at it all day and it still won't move.

Everyone's got their own agenda so even the info that spying will provide wont really do all that much.

Last edited by Bromaxulon; 2012-04-27 at 10:37 AM.
Bromaxulon is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 11:17 AM   [Ignore Me] #7
Bittermen
Sergeant Major
 
Bittermen's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


This is only the 40th thread on this subject.


Also spies should never be feared but to be unwary is just naive.

Last edited by Bittermen; 2012-04-27 at 11:18 AM.
Bittermen is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 12:06 PM   [Ignore Me] #8
Ailos
Contributor
Major
 
Ailos's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Just another element in the game. I highly doubt this will ever cause a major turn in the battle (other than in the sense that perhaps some of the blackops attempts may be thwarted), but the reality is that this can be combatted simply by practicing good command structure and ope-sec, both of which are two things that will set apart the true special forces outfits from the rest. If your commander is the only one that knows where we're going and you're not told until the last minute, your enemy will always be one step behind, with or without spies.
__________________
Doctors kill people one at a time. Engineers do it in batches.

Interior Crocodile Aviator
IronFist After Dark
Ailos is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 02:20 PM   [Ignore Me] #9
headcrab13
Second Lieutenant
 
headcrab13's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


I personally think spying and various forms of intel gathering will be an interesting part of the game. You'll have spies from each empire, and each will know a fraction of the others' plans. This will in no way break the game, rather it should naturally balance itself out.

Also keep in mind that the mission system is just a piece of the puzzle. You'll also have massive outfits working in secret and completing their own internal objectives. It will be very difficult to spy on what they're doing, and they'll react on the fly to compromised information.
__________________
Dark from TR Markov
PCP www.clanpcp.org
headcrab13 is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 02:30 PM   [Ignore Me] #10
Immigrant
First Lieutenant
 
Immigrant's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Yes spying will be present, however there will be counterintelligence also so Empire being spied on could actually use it to it's own advantage, it's all the part of a game. Example: Highest ranking officers from couple of stronger TR outfits could set up a secret operation using only their elite and most loyal/battle proven members.Meanwhile other lower ranking soldiers from genpop will get completely other set of objectives in order to deceive both the enemy and possible spies within your empire. If someone actually goes to such a length to rise up that high in your Empire simply to spy then I would have to say nicely played and bow to them.

Last edited by Immigrant; 2012-04-27 at 02:38 PM.
Immigrant is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 06:01 PM   [Ignore Me] #11
SgtMAD
Captain
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Gathering intel is an important part of warfare so I just plan on having spies running around,it happened in PS1 and it will happen in PS2,learn to deal with it.
SgtMAD is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 07:49 PM   [Ignore Me] #12
FINALCUT
First Sergeant
 
FINALCUT's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


It adds an edge of realism to the game imo. Just like real life warfare. Thats why good outfits use OPSEC. I am still undecided about what outfit I will join but joining and outfit seems like almost a neccesity due to things like spying. I am leaning towards the Devil dogs,they seem to have thier shit together.
FINALCUT is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-27, 08:56 PM   [Ignore Me] #13
NCLynx
Major
 
NCLynx's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


Most of the time in the original spying lead to more EXP for the people who got spied on.

(Most of the time, there were definitely times when spy would definitely stop a plan or two but not often.)
__________________

SuperTroopers is recruiting for PS2!
Originally Posted by Hamma View Post
Really? You need to take a few steps back and think before posting drivel like this. Either reply constructively or don't reply.
NCLynx is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-28, 04:38 AM   [Ignore Me] #14
Marinealver
Sergeant Major
 
Marinealver's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


As long as you have more charachters per account you will have jumping. Too bad you cant just view names by station name instead of gameplay name.

Also the only way for a player to switch sides is to well make an alt charachter. Lets just say you play NC and got tired of those noobs (jk) and join the VS, well you will have to start over as a new charachter.

Unless they add some sort of surrender/deffection type mechanic there won't be anything done.However it would be interesting to say type G on an enemy charachter to get an option or 3, Demand Surrender, Offer Surrender, Add to Nemesis list.
Marinealver is offline  
Reply With Quote
Old 2012-04-28, 05:43 AM   [Ignore Me] #15
Snipefrag
Contributor
First Lieutenant
 
Snipefrag's Avatar
 
Re: Empire jumping, spying and cloakers.


So following the logic in this thread the devs shouldnt even bother limiting accounts to 1 faction per server like it used to be back in the good old days. If they are going to make no effort to try and curb spying/empire hopping then why bother? There is no point putting a swap delay in like the current solution either since you can just jump on another account.

This will surely increase the fourth empire effect making people switch factions on a whim when they are getting well beaten; which i think most people will agree (even if you arnt bothered about spying) will be detrimental to gameplay. It will also cause massive population swings whenever a certain weapon gets buffed or nerfed and people feel its over powered. We had this with the lasher in the original, even with the swapping rules.

If we factor in resources into the equation then this could make it even worse, if one faction is steam rolling everyone else then people may just flip over to soak up the resources during the good times..... Better that than having to pay station cash for their items.

No.... still not convinced theres no problem here.

Last edited by Snipefrag; 2012-04-28 at 05:47 AM.
Snipefrag is offline  
Reply With Quote
Reply
  PlanetSide Universe > PlanetSide Discussions > PlanetSide 2 Discussion

Bookmarks

Discord

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 01:09 AM.

Content © 2002-2013, PlanetSide-Universe.com, All rights reserved.
PlanetSide and the SOE logo are registered trademarks of Sony Online Entertainment Inc. © 2004 Sony Online Entertainment Inc. All rights reserved.
All other trademarks or tradenames are properties of their respective owners.
Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.