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Old 2012-03-13, 01:48 PM   [Ignore Me] #1
EVILPIG
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Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


I have spoken about these things many times during Planetside and just want to go over it again here. Most draw their opinions based on prior experience and there has been a lot of mention of Tribes here lately. Also in the past, but a resurgence lately. I have also seen and made many references to WWII Online, due it's persistence, a win condition (which you can have in a persistent environment, it does not mean "endless") and it's mission system. I want to talk about something else WWII Online offers that I have not seen much of in other games.

Immersion. WWII Online does not have names above enemy units. Infantry don't even have symbols. If you see an enemy foot soldier, you just see the uniform and the equipment. Imagine how the game would look if there were no symbols on enemies? There also was no killspam. You could look up who you killed or who killed you after that life, but it was not on the screen during play. You also could not communicate with the enemy. Now, I know that players could use 3rd party means of communicating, but not having it in game removed making it easy, as well as harassment or hate tells (the best compliment).

I know it's not what players are used to, but I would love to see a video of gameplay with enemy symbols and names turned off. I want you to imagine fighting a nameless enemy who is simply "TR" "NC" or "VS." I want you to consider gameplay that is not about putting up a billboard of killspam. Most of all, I want you to imagine how immersive it would be just seeing the graphics of the game without any symbols on the enemy. Allowing camo patterns and cloaking affects to truly try to blend in. Imagine a veteran's knowledge and ability to recognize what type of enemy unit he is looking at making a difference, vs. an icon simply telling you what it is.

Lastly, as I said, I know that most are totally used to having these elements in a game, but we are trying to separate Planetside 2 from the rest of the market. The scale will certainly do that, do you think that changing anything I spoke of would do that as well?


Actually, you already see this in most of the screeshots and the trailer. Now compare that with the GDC footage.
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Last edited by EVILPIG; 2012-03-13 at 01:51 PM.
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Old 2012-03-13, 01:53 PM   [Ignore Me] #2
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Well, PS2 is built from the ground up to be a more casual, user-friendly FPS game, so even if you turn off enemy names/icons and so on, you're still left with guys wearing bright armor whose guns all shoot tracer rounds and who can't prone. It would take a pretty extensive overhaul of the game to make it similar to how WW2OL does things. I guess it would be interesting, but it wouldn't be Planetside.
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Old 2012-03-13, 01:55 PM   [Ignore Me] #3
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


If you recall.

PS one did not show health/armor bars, unless you had the implant. It also did not show them on the mini-map unless there was a motion sensor, or audio implant.

It should stay this way.
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Old 2012-03-13, 01:57 PM   [Ignore Me] #4
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by Warborn View Post
Well, PS2 is built from the ground up to be a more casual, user-friendly FPS game, so even if you turn off enemy names/icons and so on, you're still left with guys wearing bright armor whose guns all shoot tracer rounds and who can't prone. It would take a pretty extensive overhaul of the game to make it similar to how WW2OL does things. I guess it would be interesting, but it wouldn't be Planetside.
I wasn't speaking of any mechanics beyond those I mentioned. I feel they could help immersion. I'm not looking to clone anything. Planetside 2 is attempting a compilation of the best elements of games.
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Old 2012-03-13, 01:58 PM   [Ignore Me] #5
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


I expect elements such as names above heads, and so on will be toggleable.
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Old 2012-03-13, 01:58 PM   [Ignore Me] #6
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by MrBloodworth View Post
If you recall.

PS one did not show health/armor bars, unless you had the implant. It also did not show them on the mini-map unless there was a motion sensor, or audio implant.

It should stay this way.
True, but you always have at least the name of the infantry or the type of vehicle.
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Old 2012-03-13, 01:59 PM   [Ignore Me] #7
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


I could do without the icon and names.

I do enjoy the killspam and communications though. Especially local and /tell.
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:04 PM   [Ignore Me] #8
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by Skitrel View Post
I expect elements such as names above heads, and so on will be toggleable.

It was mentioned once by Higby if I recall correctly, he said that there will be no names over the enemy heads.

I was happy enough to hear that, but when the GDC footage came out they had red or green symbols on the toons.

I hope that was something just for demonstration purposes. Because frankly if you are going to put an indicator over our toons, you might as well stick our names back up there.
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:06 PM   [Ignore Me] #9
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


From what I remember, in PS1 you had to somewhat aim at a person before the name showed up for enemies, but friendlies almost always showed up. The enhanced targeting implant would make that happen faster, and added the health and armor bar. I think if the enemy shot or made noise it also make the name appear. It wasn't like spotting though, more of an automatic game mechanic.
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:10 PM   [Ignore Me] #10
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


You're joking arent you EP? We've got a game thats gone from PS to BF w/new skins and you want no names overhead to create immersion? Come on man. We've got AoE healing grenades, ammo boxes being tossed around everywhere, sticky bombs, maxes doing suicide MCT rushes for spawns w/C4 strapped all over their asses. Jetpack INF, and so much more. I just DONT see name tags as anything remotely limiting in immersion for this new PS2. And, most if not all of that is being lapped up by the masses around here. You'd have a better chance of getting WWIIOL trademarked "parachuting dogs" in this game then no tags.


FYI, name tags/no tags is a toggle in WWIIOL, not necessarily the way the game comes out of the box. Its ctl+i for 'names-no names-unit spawned'.

Have a nice day.
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:15 PM   [Ignore Me] #11
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by Warborn View Post
Well, PS2 is built from the ground up to be a more casual, user-friendly FPS game, so even if you turn off enemy names/icons and so on, you're still left with guys wearing bright armor whose guns all shoot tracer rounds and who can't prone. It would take a pretty extensive overhaul of the game to make it similar to how WW2OL does things. I guess it would be interesting, but it wouldn't be Planetside.
Is no prone confirmed?

You know, if Planetside is popular enough maybe they could have a hardcore server where people can prone, weapons don't fire tracers (that can be seen by the enemy, anyway), etc.

Note that I'm not talking about immersion though, I'm talking about casualization ie, situations where the enemy nametags help you confirm friend or foe instead of forcing the player to use his own eyes.

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Old 2012-03-13, 02:18 PM   [Ignore Me] #12
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by Skittles View Post
You're joking arent you EP? We've got a game thats gone from PS to BF w/new skins and you want no names overhead to create immersion? Come on man. We've got AoE healing grenades, ammo boxes being tossed around everywhere, sticky bombs, maxes doing suicide MCT rushes for spawns w/C4 strapped all over their asses. Jetpack INF, and so much more. I just DONT see name tags as anything remotely limiting in immersion for this new PS2. And, most if not all of that is being lapped up by the masses around here. You'd have a better chance of getting WWIIOL trademarked "parachuting dogs" in this game then no tags.


FYI, name tags/no tags is a toggle in WWIIOL, not necessarily the way the game comes out of the box. Its ctl+i for 'names-no names-unit spawned'.

Have a nice day.
Nothing in your first paragraph takes away from immersion, it's all futuristic. As for WWII Online, I'm an old school player, so that must have changed as they changed from it being a "simulator" to a "game".
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:20 PM   [Ignore Me] #13
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Prone not being in has been confirmed.

New server with "hardcore" rules is almost certain never to happen.
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:22 PM   [Ignore Me] #14
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by Knocky View Post

It was mentioned once by Higby if I recall correctly, he said that there will be no names over the enemy heads.

I was happy enough to hear that, but when the GDC footage came out they had red or green symbols on the toons.

I hope that was something just for demonstration purposes. Because frankly if you are going to put an indicator over our toons, you might as well stick our names back up there.
It's a Q key 3D spotting system, same as Battlefield has. Allows players to spot targets and essentially communicate enemy locations to people they can't communicate over voip with. They're not over them permanently, just when spotted.

Works well in Battlefield and ought to work well in Planetside. I support it.
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Old 2012-03-13, 02:27 PM   [Ignore Me] #15
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Re: Submersion - enemy icons, communications and killspam.


Originally Posted by EVILPIG View Post
True, but you always have at least the name of the infantry or the type of vehicle.
I thought that was on hover.
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