This game just became officially p2w - Page 4

Ruffdog · 2014-07-03, 04:54 AM

I'm finding with a demanding job and 2 young kids that time is a currency.
Giving players choice how to fund unlocks is a good thing.
If you're worrying about whether the laser guided smg carrier who killed you paid in time or cash then I envy you.
If it gets to cash only on anything, then go ahead and moan. I think camos are p2w personally.

BlaxicanX · 2014-07-03, 06:28 AM

I agree.

And honestly, these days I feel like SOE is handing out XP boosts like fucking candy. Double EXP weekends, EXP buffs just from being in a squad with someone who's got a boost. Extra EXP from fighting on an alert (not just winning), extra EXP from fighting in a mission-assigned base.

Just by being logged in and playing the game, I often find myself having like 120+% exp gain at times.

Since I play as a medic predominantly, getting 100-200 certs a day is not at all difficult for me, no SC required.

VaderShake · 2014-07-03, 07:07 AM

Originally Posted by Ruffdog

I'm finding with a demanding job and 2 young kids that time is a currency.
Giving players choice how to fund unlocks is a good thing.
If you're worrying about whether the laser guided smg carrier who killed you paid in time or cash then I envy you.
If it gets to cash only on anything, then go ahead and moan. I think camos are p2w personally.

Similar situation and time is a currency for sure.

On the Camo discussion there are a few camos that can be a bit confounding for each faction, but honestly I don't feel like I am at a disadvantage because of it and ultimately it's a wash.

If certain items become cash only, it would surely ruin the game. On a side note I have some station cash sitting in the bank but I have been using certs to purchase stuff the last few months because I am earning them so readily that it makes sense.

CmdAtino · 2014-07-05, 08:26 AM

It honestly doesn't matter because this game has already been having a "pay to win" (more certs) option since the start. An option for people who either do not possess any patience, or people who have a job (hence more expendable income and less play time, which is fair game, it counter balances).

Either way, from the start, paying for a membership grants you almost twice, if not three times the amount of certs, members are also more or less all BR100, which skews the game a bit because BR50 free members out skill BR100 members who got their levels through their xp boost.

In the end it's fine, whichever way people want to play, right now I can't see the point of a membership other than ruining my own game experience by unlocking things way too damn fast and not getting to actually enjoying the game, what some people think is only obtainable through "grinding" is what provided me with hours and hours of fun in battles.
It's all a matter of perspective.

And on a game at the scale of PS2 anyways, who is going to notice the difference between a member who has spammed his certs into his libby's defense that he is impossible to bring down, or into scat maxes, or the compulsive spender who paid 3£ per arm on his scat max to get one extra clicky clicky and a bit more range. It isn't going to matter.

TL-DR; It doesn't matter if people can buy weapon attachments or cert upgrades, good for them, good for us because they overpaid for an item and it funds the game more whilst not giving them an upgrade we can't get from a few hours of good fun!
All I want is for the prices and "pay now" buttons to not be in my face, or in the face of a new player, who will start thinking this game is pay to win.

Hamma · 2014-07-05, 02:55 PM

The game only becomes pay to win when you can only buy power via cash money and in no other way. Nothing changes, the stuff can still be purchased via freely flowing cert points (seriously when was the last time you ran out?) The only thing this does is get new players in earlier if they want to.

I know it's unpopular to sell things in a free to play game. But it costs money to run these games, they have to make money to keep giving people content and updates. Otherwise it just becomes PlanetSide 1 and dies in a few years.

Game's cannot be 100% free, there has to be a revenue source somewhere. More importantly a revenue source that is consumable. This is the reason for the implants.

Side note: Cut the crap on the personal attacks. Debate the game's features and functions, not each others personalities or tendency to have opinions.

MaxDamage · 2014-07-05, 06:28 PM

Yeah this is officially pay to win.
There is no way to claim otherwise now..
Such things are an instant advantage, not a mere lubricator like xp / resource boosts.

Don't even try to defend it, anyone who isn't already a fan of the game is not dumb enough to believe you and it makes you sound desperate and deluded.

I got that "ahh.. this is wrong" feeling when I saw it.
It's instinctive, dirty, nasty.

Like looking at photos of Frantastic on OKCupid.

Ghoest9 · 2014-07-05, 07:11 PM

It doesnt feel like play to win.

Its so easy to unlock the weapons attachments you need to be a good that this is a non-issue.

SixShooter · 2014-07-05, 09:29 PM

Originally Posted by Ruffdog

I'm finding with a demanding job and 2 young kids that time is a currency.
Giving players choice how to fund unlocks is a good thing.
If you're worrying about whether the laser guided smg carrier who killed you paid in time or cash then I envy you.
If it gets to cash only on anything, then go ahead and moan. I think camos are p2w personally.

^^^THIS!!!^^^

While I generally only buy boosts, I couldn't care less if the other guy buys weapons or attachments - why would I?

BlaxicanX · 2014-07-06, 12:20 AM

Originally Posted by MaxDamage

Yeah this is officially pay to win.
There is no way to claim otherwise now..
Such things are an instant advantage, not a mere lubricator like xp / resource boosts.

Don't even try to defend it, anyone who isn't already a fan of the game is not dumb enough to believe you and it makes you sound desperate and deluded.

I got that "ahh.. this is wrong" feeling when I saw it.
It's instinctive, dirty, nasty.

Like looking at photos of Frantastic on OKCupid.

What's the difference between being killed by a BR1 that has a silencer, red-dot sight and laser sight on his carbine and being killed by a BR100 that has a silencer, red-dot sight and laser sight on his carbine?

Nothing.

Tyluroth · 2014-07-06, 01:10 PM

I disagree about buying upgrades being P2W. They still don't help you aim and make smart decisions. Yeah sure you can spam OMGWTFLOLNOOBPODS from your reaver all day long I guess. But these changes would not benefit a player like me overall. I can't aim for crap.

Badass Preacher · 2014-07-06, 01:30 PM

I don't know about pay-2-win, but for me it's about principle. I still remember the promises that were made... "You will never be able to buy certs with money" and "time invested, is going to matter in this game". It's a slippery slope, and personally I don't like where it's headed.

MaxDamage · 2014-07-06, 03:23 PM

Originally Posted by BlaxicanX

What's the difference between being killed by a BR1 that has a silencer, red-dot sight and laser sight on his carbine and being killed by a BR100 that has a silencer, red-dot sight and laser sight on his carbine?

Nothing.

Wrong.

One of them (for the sake of argument) earned it.
The vast array of certification customisations are the result and reward of a players personal journey and choices. Their investment in the game.

If you can't understand why BR1 Captain Herpaderp jumping into a fight shouting "HEY GUYS IT'S A ME, HERPADERP! I AM LE PRO!" with a superior certed all-round character than a rank 75+ legit (F2P or subscriber) player who has invested time and money for the past year and a half to get where they are.. then maybe the combination of the three words "Pay To Win" are too complex for your mindtank to compute.

There has always been "progression" in the game, which was seperated from transactions (outside of weapon variants). The focus has been on EARNING it, as it should be.
This is MASSIVE.

May I recommend you despawn at the nearest matrix panel and have a techie ensure your DNA resequencing program hasn't been corrupted.

RSphil · 2014-07-06, 03:29 PM

p2w being used in the wrong way again. it is not p2w as all this can be unlocked with certs but i do think it is a bad idea as i think certs are a waste of time now, the way this is going do you think they are going to get rid of certs. having all this available for SC is taking away from progression and a feeling of accomplishment.

they need to look at certs/progression again and stop making everything available for SC. i know they need to make money but there has to be a better way. i know its convenience and getting rid of a sort of grind but it lessens the reason to strive for certs
so you can get something cool or helpful.

BlaxicanX · 2014-07-06, 03:49 PM

Originally Posted by MaxDamage

Wrong.

One of them (for the sake of argument) earned it.

> Implying that getting certs is always an honorable process and you can't easily rack up enough certs to unlock all the attachments for a gun you want in a single one-hour session of Lib-farming spawns or doing other sleazy shit.

If you can't understand why BR1 Captain Herpaderp jumping into a fight shouting "HEY GUYS IT'S A ME, HERPADERP! I AM LE PRO!" with a superior certed all-round character than a rank 75+ legit (F2P or subscriber) player who has invested time and money for the past year and a half to get where they are..

>Implying that there is no such thing as a BR1 who might have another toon with three times the game-time logged that you or any "BR100MLGPRO36NOSCOPESWAG" player might have.

This is MASSIVE.

No, it isn't. It's arbitrary nonsense, and it certainly isn't "pay 2 win". Pay 2 Win has a definition, you know. It's not some silly buzz word that an individual can shape to mean whatever they want it to mean. A pay2win system is explicitly a game in which there are in-game advantages that you can only acquire by spending money. No such system exists in Planetside 2. Your "stand-up-by-your-bootstraps" complaint has nothing to do with Pay2Win.

And it's nonsense anyway. Using your very logic, I guess subs shouldn't get monthly SC or passive cert bonuses, right? I mean after all, using *your* logic here, who "earned" that red-dot sight more, the guy who has no sub account cert-bonus and had to get 30 kills to make enough certs to afford that red-dot, or the guy who has a sub account cert-bonus and had to get 10 kills to make enough certs to afford that red-dot sight? You might say "they both had to at least play!" but it doesn't change the fact that one guy had to play a lot harder to get that red-dot. I guess it's Pay2Win, right?

No. No it isn't.

This is a video game, not a job, and not everyone is a happy-go-lucky college student with no responsibilities who can spend 10 hours a day playing this game to unlock everything. In a game which relies on having a massive a population at all times to function, manly pride takes a backseat to fairness, and in this case, the dude with a Monday-Friday 9-to-5 has just as much of a right to run around the battlefield with a decked out gun as you do.

No one's forcing you to spend money on these guns, and objectively, a BR1 with a red-dot sight on his gun isn't effecting your play-style anymore than a BR100 with a red-dot sight does, so why get jammed up about it? Do you, brother. Don't trip on what other people are doing.

AuntLou · 2014-07-06, 04:22 PM

I wish they would just say "Yep sure it's pay to win and that is how it's going to be." Cause seriously why do you guys even care?

Play the game, it's freaken GREAT! Keep in mind they have to make money to keep it up. Pretty basic shit there guys. Whats the worse thing that can happen here? A new player gets a step up and doesn't get farmed for his first 30 levels?