ProSieben Responds to Community Concerns

[Hamma]

http://www.planetside-universe.com/news-prosieben-responds-to-community-concerns-2690.htm

[dpranker]

Great news, it's good to see they aren't completely blind to what the community wants

[Cobalt]

I have a feeling this is more casued by the Everquest population, but hopefully it will make them change their plans.

[SniperSteve]

That's really good to hear. Hopefully they are able to work something out that still keeps regional servers yet gives players free roam to go to whatever server they want.

[Xaine]

I'm very impressed. Apparently they really sat up and took notice.

If they actually change something this big because we asked for it, i'll never say a bad word about SoE again.

A massive Thank You to everyone involved, especially RadarX for being so active with us through this, along with Higby.

Its heartening to see you guys putting the time in to reassure us. :)

[Oryon22]

This is very encouraging. All I can say is thanks for listening PSS1 and SOE.

[Vancha]

Great news, it's good to see they aren't completely blind to what the community wants

The problem is that they're completely blind to what the community doesn't want.

The community doesn't want ProSieben. I'm glad that we'll get to play together again, but I'm not sure if two steps back, one step forward is something to be commended? For any other company that wouldn't count as progress, but for SOE? I'm not really sure...

[Shanesan]

We shall see. Of course, seeing Alaplaya actually doing something right is as often as SoE recently - not high. They stepped on a hornet's nest. Lets see how many times they will get stung.

[Snipefrag]

Holy carp, maybe they will actually listen this time !

[Firefly]

It's a case of "vote with your dollar". Not a case of "this should have been a fucking abortion the moment it was conceived". It should have been killed with fire from Moment Zero.

The problem is that they're completely blind to what the community doesn't want.

The community doesn't want ProSieben. I'm glad that we'll get to play together again, but I'm not sure if two steps back, one step forward is something to be commended? For any other company that wouldn't count as progress, but for SOE? I'm not really sure...
I agree. It's good news for us, but the fact that they were oblivious to the stupidity of the idea from the get-go is troublesome. I can understand having a distributor or shipper in another country. What I don't understand is why force separation?

[Vash02]

It's a case of "vote with your dollar". Not a case of "this should have been a fucking abortion the moment it was conceived". It should have been killed with fire from Moment Zero.


I agree. It's good news for us, but the fact that they were oblivious to the stupidity of the idea from the get-go is troublesome. I can understand having a distributor or shipper in another country. What I don't understand is why force separation?

It probably becuase both companies have only done this kind of thing before with the Asian market where there is little or no community interaction between the East and West. They must of thought (stupidly) that it would be fine to do the same in the west.
I mean like theres totally a massive ocean between America and Europe MIRITE?

[Gimpylung]

Smedley needs to come up with a plan before he clocks out at the end of Friday, how many more EQ subs will they lose over the weekend if this is left hanging.

[RedKnights]

"Actually we are, yes. This topic is currently being discussed internally and at SOE. I can't tell you all the detials now, but I hope that we are able to loose some restrictions. And for existing accounts that play on us servers and vise versa, they will be able to do so in the future.

So for all existing SOE-Players: We are trying hard to find a solution that you don't get seperated.
sincerely
Coldor "
==============================
Before weekend we will not have an answer. Sorry about it but the Technicans needs to figure out things first.
If the idea works out we will have no barriers for everyone but we need to see and wait what is possible.

Before abandon and run away I would wait as the idea we have in mind really solves a lot.
Protagonist

Keep in mind these were posted on the Ala-Playa boards too.

To me it sounds like a workaround that will keep current SOE accounts able to use both companies' services.

What concerns me is what if their friends want to play Planetside 2? Will they not be able to play with their RL friends then?

[Vancha]

Keep in mind these were posted on the Ala-Playa boards too.

To me it sounds like a workaround that will keep current SOE accounts able to use both companies' services.

What concerns me is what if their friends want to play Planetside 2? Will they not be able to play with their RL friends then?
If new players aren't given the freedom to choose between NA and EU, it still won't be acceptable in the eyes of a lot of people. The distinction between "workaround" and "solution" is an important one. PS2 and EQNext need the solution, not the workaround.

[RedKnights]

If new players aren't given the freedom to choose between NA and EU, it still won't be acceptable in the eyes of a lot of people. The distinction between "workaround" and "solution" is an important one. PS2 and EQNext need the solution, not the workaround.

QFT.

I can't agree with you more. The optimal solution would be to just have SOE continue server administration.

[Kran De Loy]

<3 Hamma for summing up the important bits in the News section.
<3 Smed for at least giving the community hope.
<3 Everyone at SOE for making the game in the first place.

I understand that with a major deal like this there is a lot of details and no one person can or should be held responsible for knowing everything in it. That said...

<3<3<3<3<3<3<3 The first person to smack the one responsible for the segregation bits.

[Shogun]

thanks hamma, for summing up the answers we got!
will this news section be updated when we get new answers?

[Hydra]

Talk to me when something is actually done, The fact that this even happened and went this far is still moronic.

[Baron]

I understand why SOE would want to partner with PRO7. From what I understand (granted i'm from Texas ;) ) PRO7 is a well known gaming media company in the EU. This makes perfect sense and I think it could really benefit PS2 in the EU. That kind of massive media attention could even bleed over here to the US as well.

Strategic Partnership: No problem with this
Tactical Execution: Needs work

[Raymac]

For a multinational business deal, the speed at which they have responded to the community's concerns is extremely impressive. I'm sure they considered the blowback from having exclusivity, but they clearly underestimated just how serious seperating the players really was.

Considering all the moving parts, something like this won't change overnight, however, they've practically addressed it overnight. Most impressive, and very encouraging.

[Shogun]

when i first heard about this partnership, i was very positive about that, but the FAQ revealed far too many stupid things that may totally wreck the game.

i am from germany, and the media presence of pro7 is top notch! no doubt they will start an advertising campaign that soe could never pull off. and that´s a great thing... but the price seems to be far too high

[Trolltaxi]

I understand why SOE would want to partner with PRO7. From what I understand (granted i'm from Texas ;) ) PRO7 is a well known gaming media company in the EU. This makes perfect sense and I think it could really benefit PS2 in the EU. That kind of massive media attention could even bleed over here to the US as well.

Strategic Partnership: No problem with this
Tactical Execution: Needs work

The Pro7Sat1 conglomerate (haha...) has great share in TV-market especially in Germany. The company operates TV-channels and radio stations in german-speaking countries, in Scandinavia and Central-Europe. They have no intrest in western Europe but more importantly they have almost nothing to do with the gaming market. All they have is some marginal titles which they use to promote their only half-decent game, called S4 Leage.

But worst thing is, that they turned that f2p game into pay-to-win and did it such a rude way that they managed to alienate their community. Check this link: http://mmohuts.com/editorials/alaplaya-how-to-ruin-an-arena-shooter

[Raymac]

when i first heard about this partnership, i was very positive about that, but the FAQ revealed far too many stupid things that may totally wreck the game.

i am from germany, and the media presence of pro7 is top notch! no doubt they will start an advertising campaign that soe could never pull off. and that´s a great thing... but the price seems to be far too high

To be fair, Pro7 hasn't even done anything to you yet. To me, it just feels a little premature to hang them for a crime they haven't committed yet. Did we learn nothing from Tom Cruise in the Minority Report? ;)

[ThGlump]

PRO7 is a well known gaming media company in the EU.
Gaming? Nobody here know that pro7 has anything to do with games. They are TV/sat media company, but not a gaming (but they want to be, and thats why they bought us)

[WaryWizard]

Something I see that could be a workaround without a whole circumvention of PRO7 is make EU IPs log in with a PRO7 account. They would still have access to the US(SOE) servers, but it will keep them from ignoring PRO7. Most new EU players will probably go to the EU(PRO7) server, but if they don't keep their servers well maintained, the newberts will go US.

I know next to nothing on the technical difficulties of this.

[BigBossMonkey]

I have a feeling this is more casued by the Everquest population, but hopefully it will make them change their plans.

Well yeah, the EQ community is orders of magnitude larger than the PS community ever was.

[Vash02]

Something I see that could be a workaround without a whole circumvention of PRO7 is make EU IPs log in with a PRO7 account. They would still have access to the US(SOE) servers, but it will keep them from ignoring PRO7. Most new EU players will probably go to the EU(PRO7) server, but if they don't keep their servers well maintained, the newberts will go US.

I know next to nothing on the technical difficulties of this.
The odd thing about this deal is that SOE is still running the European servers. Pro7 just gets exclusive access to them.

[Mastachief]

when i first heard about this partnership, i was very positive about that, but the FAQ revealed far too many stupid things that may totally wreck the game.

i am from germany, and the media presence of pro7 is top notch! no doubt they will start an advertising campaign that soe could never pull off. and that´s a great thing... but the price seems to be far too high

That's the other thing, its a German TV company. The vast majority of the planetside euro player base was from the UK then The netherlands and France. With countries like Germany, Austria, Finland, Sweden etc bringing up the rear. The game is after all English speaking which presents a barrier (which it should) this is why the Chinese and Russians need their own server. Modern Europe pretty much demands that their youth speaks English for decent employment. We already see in pro7 (or whatever other name they use) has PR people in their community with less than passing English it reads like language written by Indian or Chinese.

Don't get me wrong I like German people (well some of them) but if i'm paying for a service i expect them to understand me fully and for the service to be promoted in my country properly. We all ready know how much "fun"* people talking in other languages is in the game chat.

* I need to add that i do not mean it is fun. Gotta point out the humour.

[MartinasBuddy]

Well yeah, the EQ community is orders of magnitude larger than the PS community ever was.

and soe did everything to keep it that way. planet...what?

[Sta]

That's the other thing, its a German TV company. The vast majority of the planetside euro player base was from the UK then The netherlands and France. With countries like Germany, Austria, Finland, Sweden etc bringing up the rear. The game is after all English speaking which presents a barrier (which it should) this is why the Chinese and Russians need their own server. Modern Europe pretty much demands that their youth speaks English for decent employment. We already see in pro7 (or whatever other name they use) has PR people in their community with less than passing English it reads like language written by Indian or Chinese.

Don't get me wrong I like German people (well some of them) but if i'm paying for a service i expect them to understand me fully and for the service to be promoted in my country properly. We all ready know how much "fun"* people talking in other languages is in the game chat.

* I need to add that i do not mean it is fun. Gotta point out the humour.

I believe Ive read somewhere that they would provide german, english, french and spanish customer support...

[Kran De Loy]

and soe did everything to keep it that way. planet...what?

Oh man, that made me laugh. Thank you, seriously I needed to go to sleep on something light hearted.

[Mastachief]

I believe Ive read somewhere that they would provide german, english, french and spanish customer support...

You did. But don't read that as support that works. Writing in another language is not the same as understanding that language. Looking at the pro7 Forums the support workers we can expect are school children with no experience of our game or actual experience of the language they are supporting.

Any one that has dealt with the frustration of dealing with an Indian call centre can understand the language issue where by they just keep repeating a script because they cannot understand anything else.

With SOE (atleast in the early days was all U.S based support) you ticket are dealt with by properly trained and/or experience native English speakers that understood the nuances of language, this led to the support making sense and being successful.

A perfect example would be the tech support for planetside on the forum, so random new tech guy appeared who would systematically just quote "it is you internet connection" for everything. (not sure if this support had been outsourced but it is a perfect example of what happens when you outsource)

ME: My graphics are crashing to desktop?
SOE: It is you internet connection
ME: WTF, NO my graphics are crashing to desktop at random
SOE: It is your internet connection
ME: Facepalm, nevermind.

Command chat
Me: Hi guys, my graphics keep ctd'ing
CR5: Turn off pre loading textures
Me: Thanks that fixed it

[Boomzor]

Heh, I remember an Italian group joining our outfit way way back, and only one of them spoke passing English. Had to put that guy as a constant squad leader to get them to do anything remotely along the line of what the rest of the outfit was doing. It was a meta game in itself.

Fond nostalgia aside, the channels pro7 run here (through subsidiaries I must add) all have Swedish announcers and web pages so I'm sure they'll get the language part right - eventually at the very least.
But as I've said in other threads, judging from the alfalfa (bean sprouts?!) play site, they seriously need to step up their game on all fronts before I'll allow them anywhere near my passwords, personal details or credit card numbers.

[Sardus]

$$$ speaks. Good job everyone.

[Spoof]

I'm inclined to give PSS1 the benefit of the doubt if SOE and PSS1 pull this off.

PSS1's previous games may have been mishandled, but with a AAA title like PS2 they have to pull up their socks and step up to the plate. So assuming they are doing that, and that our accounts will be handled securely, and that SOE still retains authority on server admin (no corporate fingers in weapon balance pie)...

... well, fingers crossed.

[texico]

^ :L The whole world should just speak English and dump the rest, we all know it's the best language (irrefutable) from the best country (debatable).


What I never understood is, Sony is a global company, and I'm sure they're established in Europe. Surely they could advertise and distribute PS2 in Europe, and much more effectively than a relatively unknown group like Pro7 - I don't know a great deal about the logistics of companies though.

[Hmr85]

See all that doubt and people freaking out where for nothing. You just have to have a little faith in SOE. They have been showing us that they are trying to change for the better.

Thank you for listening SOE. :cheers:

[Crator]

Isn't the reason SOE is making changes because people freaked out?

[Gandhi]

See all those doubt and people freaking out where for nothing. You just have to have a little faith in SOE. They have been showing us that they are trying to change for the better.
I think all the freaking out is what prompted these changes in the first place, not only from us but from the folks at EQ2 as well. If everyone had just said "Gee that's too bad, I hope they change it." and forgot about it nothing would have been changed.

PSS1 seems to be sincere in wanting to make this work, but goddamn do they have a lot of work to do to overcome their bad reputation. I hope they realize that.

[Geist]

Congrats everybody. BWC has a few overseas members and this is great news indeed for all international outfits.

[Vancha]

See all that doubt and people freaking out where for nothing. You just have to have a little faith in SOE. They have been showing us that they are trying to change for the better.

Thank you for listening SOE. :cheers:
Don't let them off that easy. The fact that this deal was made at all displays the utmost stupidity and I'm pretty sure they wouldn't have done anything had they not started hemorrhaging EQ2 subscriptions and getting a fair amount of bad publicity over the past few days...

The only reason this deal was made was because they succumbed to the temptation of a quick cash injection, but it'd be for naught if there wasn't a net gain despite the fallout.

[Sta]

See all those doubt and people freaking out where for nothing. You just have to have a little faith in SOE. They have been showing us that they are trying to change for the better.

Thank you for listening SOE. :cheers:

I believe thats what they call passion...

[Trolltaxi]

I simply cannot beleive that SOE gives so much space to pro7 that they could even turn the game into pay-to-win. (which pro7 has already made to other titles)

That would ruin the Planetside brand (and SOE too) forever.

[Hermes]

Glad they are listening, hopefully a reasonable solution will follow for our outfit communities. :)

Sadly im not hopefully this will also address some of the other facets of this. I liked logging onto an American server if I'm working odd hours for their prime time with an alt. Or to pop on with some friends every now and again.

But i'm guessing this is going to be some sort of one shot outfit fix rather than a change of policy.

Instead of say, offering a scaled compensation for the money invested in advertising if they detect a certain threshold of EUs logging into US for their majority playtime. :groovy:

[Straws]

The problem is that they're completely blind to what the community doesn't want.

The community doesn't want ProSieben. I'm glad that we'll get to play together again, but I'm not sure if two steps back, one step forward is something to be commended? For any other company that wouldn't count as progress, but for SOE? I'm not really sure...

Unfortunately, SOE doesn't really exist in Europe, which is why Planetside was distributed by Ubisoft over here. It's the same issue which resulted in The9 handling WoW for Blizzard in Asian territories. These companies are not as global as we would like them to be.

SOE are not in the position to become a proper operating entity in Europe, especially after the downsizing announcements last year.

In order to get their games to locations outside of the US, and to do so in a way that they don't hemorrhage money, they need to turn to companies that specialise in data storage and network integration. Customer Service comes into it as well.

HOWEVER, to sign a deal, or discuss a deal and not fight tooth and nail to prevent regional segregation, to not think that it was an important enough issue to cancel that deal and go with someone else? That's an issue I have.

The future of MMOs is meant to be grander. Get as many players playing together as possible. It's the whole point of MMOs. Social gaming. This agreement, regardless of it being overturned or not, is not something ANY games publisher should accept from their partners. Sony, EA, Square-Enix, Activition, none of these companies should ever have their entire product listing announced as part of such a giant backwards step.

The agreement implies that the MMO industry is in a regression, it's not. This honestly feels like a bunch of old guys in a directors meeting just accepting what is infront of them without a second thought. Dismissive. The individuals with SOE, or SCE who honestly thought that this was not an issue needs to have all these comments tatoo'd on the insides of their eyelids. It's as if no one consulted anyone in a marketing position.

Bad for the Players.
Bad for SOE.
Bad for the MMO industry.

[ThGlump]

^ :L The whole world should just speak English and dump the rest, we all know it's the best language (irrefutable) from the best country (debatable).

Even native english speakers are minority in europe, most players can speak english to some extend. And when speaking to customer support its best to minimize possibility of some information is lost in translation. So i rather speak to native english speaker (only translation needed by me) than to german who have to translate it further.
I dont expect to have support in my language when my whole country has less population than one big US city :)

[Sta]

Even native english speakers are minority in europe, most players can speak english to some extend. And when speaking to customer support its best to minimize possibility of some information is lost in translation. So i rather speak to native english speaker (only translation needed by me) than to german who have to translate it further.
I dont expect to have support in my language when my whole country has less population than one big US city :)

Maybe its different in america but here in europe Im nut sure that just because its a german company you've to automatically talk to Germans trying to speak anything else than german also.. I've absolutely no idea how it works but what I know is that here in germany you get the feeling of a " Lets Germanize everything we can movement" since the end of the 20th century... The germans I know speak very rarely enthusiastically english or any other foreign language.. I doubt you will end up talking to retards on the other end of the line..
Either they hire native speakers of your language in germany or connect you directly to their guys in uk, france, spain etc...
They're way too lazy to handle it themselves :lol:

[bjorntju1]

Atleast those past-due people with they released on their forums, weren't past-due at all:

http://en.alaplaya.net/forum/support-f66/re-open-payments-t12991.html

Clarification for what this list stands! It is NOT a list when users were due with payments. It was a list to find the users who made a wire transfer!

Well, that is what they say :P

[Plissket]

The more details I here about this deal the worse it gets, even if Prosebien are sincere and try hard they just are not a fit at all for running SOE's games.

Almost every aspect of the FAQ would need to change to make it work, one example is security, Sony is a key target for hackers, I would not have much of a problem with Prosebien on their own (although they seem amateurish with the wire transfers - they should have been returned), but linked to Sony and I just have no faith that they have the level of security needed.

E.g. local TA armoury is pretty secure, but I wouldn't trust it to store the UK's nuclear arsenal in.

[arclegger]

http://www.movie-list.com/posters/big/zoom/everybodysfine.jpg

[DayOne]

More like:

[bjorntju1]

More like:

Magic camera!

[Ragefighter]

Even native english speakers are minority in europe, most players can speak english to some extend. And when speaking to customer support its best to minimize possibility of some information is lost in translation. So i rather speak to native english speaker (only translation needed by me) than to german who have to translate it further.
I dont expect to have support in my language when my whole country has less population than one big US city :)

in the US it's pretty much all "press 1 for English, press two for Spanish" on all support from large companies.

I am all for online chat based service. (text based) if it is done correctly.
Whenever I had a problem with an SOE game/account I would log into the chat server on the support site and after a short wait the issue was fixed promptly. Who knows where they are from or sound like idc it got fixed. SOE in game support from EQ2 was pretty good too, i mean it took like 45min-1hr or so to get a GM sometimes depending on the situation but never had a problem with language or stupid answers.

People with strong accents in their voice can be hard to understand but they might type very clearly. sometimes even local CS can be a bitch on the phone, you get someone with a hardcore southern drawl to try and tell someone from NY something, that's got problem all over it hehe.

I assume in Canada it would, generally, be English and French.

For us in the US there is really just English and some Spanish.

[DayOne]

Magic camera!

It sees what people want to feel but can't because of stupid decisions!

[ShazMyBot]

Everything is fine.
Do not panic.
Be sure to take your government-issued medication and eat your Soilent Green.

[Wakken]

I really hope this solution of theirs allow me to use my SOE account even if I live in EU. I dont want to have a ProSieben account. I dont trust them

[NewSith]

Judging from what I see about the company I can tell that even some Russian server hosters can do better.

At least in that case I can go to them and start smahing faces if something goes wrong...

[Chefkoch]

The problem is that they're completely blind to what the community doesn't want.

The community doesn't want ProSieben.

THIS !!

I bet they wont take a step back. Money is allready payed..so its over.

I wonder if Planetside 2 will be aviable over Steam then ? Its only the biggest digital platform.

Chef

[ViaDolorosa]

It's ofc good that soe and their new partner at least heard the cry of community but I can't feel any relieve before they bring out some specific plan.

[Figment]

But as I've said in other threads, judging from the alfalfa (bean sprouts?!) play site, they seriously need to step up their game on all fronts before I'll allow them anywhere near my passwords, personal details or credit card numbers.

Alaplaya: Spanish (For Brits, read: "some form of 'Foreign' from the southern part of The Continent" ;)) for "to the beach".

[cellinaire]

Talk to me when something is actually done, The fact that this even happened and went this far is still moronic.

You nailed it ;)

[Trolltaxi]

Everybody's Fine

Well, I'd be fine with Kate or Drew too, but what about communities (PS, EQ, DCUO)?

What about "won't sell power" in case of pro7 who already showed they can roadkill f2p games whenever they want?

[tkoreaper]

Of course it's going to be the community that is going to demand all the credit for this even though SOE said they we still discussing how things would work. People need to realize that due to the nature of the partnership, it wasn't very logical to keep everyone together. I say that because while it is a partnership, they each have full control only of their own region... To still keep them connected kinda removes the point of even having a partnership.

[Kran De Loy]

As long as SOE and PSS1 remove all region locking than I full believe that the game will last long enough to at least return their investments as well as each company's minimum expectations of profit from the game. With region locking that becomes much more questionable.

The entire point of MMO is a critical mass of players playing together simultaneously. With an F2P game, the more players = more competition = more revenue generated. More players also = more revenue generated just by themselves without the added factor of players competing against each other. There have got to be plenty of research papers that prove that.

[Kran De Loy]

Of course it's going to be the community that is going to demand all the credit for this even though SOE said they we still discussing how things would work. People need to realize that due to the nature of the partnership, it wasn't very logical to keep everyone together. I say that because while it is a partnership, they each have full control only of their own region... To still keep them connected kinda removes the point of even having a partnership.

Er.. this made me look up the term partnership in a business sense, of the three sites I looked at from google this one seemed the most composed or best explained. All of them supported each other. Also this is of course from a US standpoint.
http://www.investorwords.com/3609/partnership.html
partnership
Definitions (2)
1. A type of unincorporated business organization in which multiple individuals, called general partners, manage the business and are equally liable for its debts; other individuals called limited partners may invest but not be directly involved in management and are liable only to the extent of their investments. Unlike a Limited Liability Company or a corporation, in a partnership each partner shares equal responsibility for the company's profits and losses, and its debts and liabilities. The partnership itself does not pay income taxes, but each partner has to report their share of business profits or losses on their individual tax return. Estimated tax payments are also necessary for each of the partners for the year in progress. Partnerships must file a return on Form 1065 showing income and deductions. Estimated tax payments are also required if they expect their income to be greater than $1,000.
2. More generally, a relationship of two or more entities conducting business for mutual benefit.


The other two links:
http://legal-dictionary.thefreedictionary.com/Business+partnership
http://www.entrepreneur.com/encyclopedia/term/82334.html

What I'm trying to say is that the nature of the partnership as you put it, it up to the partners in the contract.

[Mechzz]

As long as SOE and PSS1 remove all region locking than I full believe that the game will last long enough to at least return their investments as well as each company's minimum expectations of profit from the game. With region locking that becomes much more questionable.


This.

[Vancha]

Of course it's going to be the community that is going to demand all the credit for this even though SOE said they we still discussing how things would work.

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=88000028458#88000471766

You were saying?

[DaddyTickles]

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=88000028458#88000471766

You were saying?

I wish my wife was as equally responsive to my perfectly reasonable user requests :(

[Vancha]

I wish my wife was as equally responsive to my perfectly reasonable user requests :(

Just do what the EQII guys did to make SOE listen...



Unsubscribe.



From your wife.

[Mechzz]

Unsubscribe.
From your wife.

This.

Is what I did after 6 months of playing PS1 in 2004. With hindsight it would have been cheaper to unsubscribe from PS :huh:

[RadarX]

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=88000028458#88000471766

You were saying?

This issue was anticipated to a point but player feedback provides something tangible to show exactly how everyone feels.

[Vancha]

This issue was anticipated to a point but player feedback provides something tangible to show exactly how everyone feels.
The sheer ignorance of the people who made this decision is the only defence they've got so far. Surely you shouldn't be telling us things that'll make us even angrier with them? :p

[Goku]

This issue was anticipated to a point but player feedback provides something tangible to show exactly how everyone feels.

I think its rather obvious to even people not within those positions figuring out possible back lashes against such a huge policy shift would know this whole firestorm would be created. Splitting up whole communities that have been together since EQ, isn't something you can sweep under the rug.

[Nephilimuk]

This issue was anticipated to a point but player feedback provides something tangible to show exactly how everyone feels.

Radar I really like what your doing but that statement is very interesting

I have to ask wouldn't customer consultation worked a little better than what has just happened?

If and that’s a big one that this was all planned then someone must have really needed to make a point and this has the opportunity to back fire spectacularly. I wonder how you classify self mutilation in a risk register.

[Shogun]

this news should be updated... since we got some new answers now that really count!

as in this thread: http://forums.station.sony.com/ps/posts/list.m?start=0&topic_id=88000028458#88000471766

quote virrago (soe CRM): Far as I know, there are no discussions to limit access to beta based on region at this time.

that´s another issue hopefully solved.

and radarx told us this:
To make this 100% clear, Prosieben is a partner in distributing our games in the EU. SOE remains the sole developer of game content for PlanetSide 2 and any of our other games. If something goes in the game, it will be because we created it.

so for me the major issues seem to be fixed.
i just need another clarification from radarx! so, all content of the game and the shop will come from soe, that´s great. but will pro7 be able to mess with the shop, or does this count as content that only soe has control over?
i fear that pro7 puts things in the shop that are free on u.s. servers, or that they mess with the stats to encourage people to buy weapons (pay 2 win).
just tell us, that all stats, balancing and shop-placements will still be soe´s concern!

[Nephilimuk]

Based directly on player feedback, we are in discussions with ProSieben regarding ways to keep our player communities together.

That just says they are trying to work it out - not they have worked it out. I am not trying to be a dick here I just want point out that whilst this is a fantastic statement it delivers nothing.

[RadarX]

I think its rather obvious to even people not within those positions figuring out possible back lashes against such a huge policy shift would know this whole firestorm would be created. Splitting up whole communities that have been together since EQ, isn't something you can sweep under the rug.

Nothing was swept under the rug. This was of course a negative in this however the potential it could bring our existing and future customers and products I think is severely misunderstood. This is going to provide a level of support for the EU that we have never been able to do. This company will also do television (actual television) marketing that we just don't have the resources to do getting this in front of millions of viewers.

Either way, as stated, they are currently looking at options that will satisfy our existing customers. It's just going to take some time.

[Mirror]

Nothing was swept under the rug. This was of course a negative in this however the potential it could bring our existing and future customers and products I think is severely misunderstood. This is going to provide a level of support for the EU that we have never been able to do. This company will also do television (actual television) marketing that we just don't have the resources to do getting this in front of millions of viewers.

Either way, as stated, they are currently looking at options that will satisfy our existing customers. It's just going to take some time.

So let them do their thing which is advertise because it clear with everything thats been found on the internet that this company only cares about making money and doesnt care about their customers or their games.

[Vancha]

Nothing was swept under the rug. This was of course a negative in this however the potential it could bring our existing and future customers and products I think is severely misunderstood. This is going to provide a level of support for the EU that we have never been able to do. This company will also do television (actual television) marketing that we just don't have the resources to do getting this in front of millions of viewers.

Either way, as stated, they are currently looking at options that will satisfy our existing customers. It's just going to take some time.
Support and marketing is all well and good, and will be much appreciated if PSS1 manages to provide that better than they've done for their other games, but the thing that isn't being explained is why that necessitates regional segregation.

It's not a coincidence that the most consistently successful MMO is the MMO with a single server where every player who plays it can play together (EVE). Existing customers being able to play with their communities is of course great (even if such a thing should never have been in question), and for us, personally, that's what matters the most...but for the game itself, letting new customers play together is even more important. Why is regional segregation a requirement for PSS1 to provide superior support and marketing, or profit from EU cash shop purchases and EU subscriptions?

[Trolltaxi]

PS (the original) badly lacked media coverage - now it seems PS2 gets what it deserves.

Region lock will be of no importance for the hundreds of thousands (or at least tens of thousands) of new players. They will be served with low ping and an EU company doing the support.

But no one has ever confirmed yet that pro7 will not sell power. Damn, they did it in the past, what holds them back now?

[RadarX]

So let them do their thing which is advertise because it clear with everything thats been found on the internet that this company only cares about making money and doesn't care about their customers or their games.

To be fair I think most of what you are referring to is Alaplaya which until 2011 was not owned by Prosieben. You can also see significant efforts by Alaplaya to ensure players much of the concerns they have are surrounding old business practices or different types of deals entirely.

Prosieben is our publisher and support partner. SOE is making the games.

[Vancha]

Region lock will be of no importance for the hundreds of thousands (or at least tens of thousands) of new players. They will be served with low ping and an EU company doing the support.

Wrong. I know communities that play or pass on games depending on whether they can play them together. I've also seen plenty of people already saying they won't play this based on the region lock.

[basti]

To be fair I think most of what you are referring to is Alaplaya which until 2011 was not owned by Prosieben. You can also see significant efforts by Alaplaya to ensure players much of the concerns they have are surrounding old business practices or different types of deals entirely.

Prosieben is our publisher and support partner. SOE is making the games.

Radar, what you say is true and stuff, but it doesnt change history.
Alaplaya screwed it up in the past, big time. We all fear they screw up again. On top of that, expirience with other deals similar to this one (NCsoft West and others) made us worrying.
Stuff simply went bad loads of times, we dont want it to go bad for PS2. Thats why you guys should avoid a dedicated account system for Europe. This way it would be pretty clear that Pro7 doesnt have much access to the games code/shop. Yes, i know, they dont have access to the code anyway, but there are a few thousand people that dont know that/dont believe that.


We are just afraid. Planetside was a brilliant game, everyone here agrees. Planetside 2 could bring this all back, and make it even bigger and better. We are just afraid that Pro7 could screw it up. And this fear wont go away till we are actually playing after release.

[General M]

To be fair I think most of what you are referring to is Alaplaya which until 2011 was not owned by Prosieben. You can also see significant efforts by Alaplaya to ensure players much of the concerns they have are surrounding old business practices or different types of deals entirely.

Prosieben is our publisher and support partner. SOE is making the games.

Please just tell us the EU are going to get a beta. IMO this would show a massive commitment to the EU players who are currently feeling a bit like second-rate customers :(

EU beta, yes or no?

[Aurmanite]

Nothing was swept under the rug. This was of course a negative in this however the potential it could bring our existing and future customers and products I think is severely misunderstood. This is going to provide a level of support for the EU that we have never been able to do. This company will also do television (actual television) marketing that we just don't have the resources to do getting this in front of millions of viewers.

Either way, as stated, they are currently looking at options that will satisfy our existing customers. It's just going to take some time.

Man, you have a hard job.

I hope you are paid well.

[basti]

Please just tell us the EU are going to get a beta. IMO this would show a massive commitment to the EU players who are currently feeling a bit like second-rate customers :(

EU beta, yes or no?

I would guess no, because we are part of the US beta. Read that somewhere, dont ask me for a source, cant find it atm :(

[General M]

I would guess no, because we are part of the US beta. Read that somewhere, dont ask me for a source, cant find it atm :(

I'm not necessarily talking about an EU only beta as such, just a way for EU players to participate in beta.

[Mirror]

To be fair I think most of what you are referring to is Alaplaya which until 2011 was not owned by Prosieben. You can also see significant efforts by Alaplaya to ensure players much of the concerns they have are surrounding old business practices or different types of deals entirely.

Prosieben is our publisher and support partner. SOE is making the games.

Thats all well and good but I don't think any of the Euro SOE subscribers want to give this company their personal details because of their previous business practices. Put yourself in our shoes, would you be comfortable giving these people your personal details after reading what has come out?

I doubt I'll get a reply to this and I don't blame you for not replying this time but seriously think about it.

[Mirror]

I'm not necessarily talking about an EU only beta as such, just a way for EU players to participate in beta.

http://forums.station.sony.com/ps/posts/list.m?start=15&topic_id=88000028458

4th post down.

Probably the highlight of a very very bad few days for us Euros.

[RadarX]

Thats all well and good but I don't think any of the Euro SOE subscribers want to give this company their personal details because of their previous business practices. Put yourself in our shoes, would you be comfortable giving these people your personal details after reading what has come out?

I doubt I'll get a reply to this and I don't blame you for not replying this time but seriously think about it.

Which practice in particular concerned you most?

[ThGlump]

To be fair I think most of what you are referring to is Alaplaya which until 2011 was not owned by Prosieben. You can also see significant efforts by Alaplaya to ensure players much of the concerns they have are surrounding old business practices or different types of deals entirely.

Prosieben is our publisher and support partner. SOE is making the games.

Once you gain bad reputation its hard to get rid of it. SOE had it back too, but lately you are staring to get plus points in communication with players and development (with direct hit to the groin for pro7 deal).

But there arent signs of alaplaya(pro7) getting better. If you (soe) want your games and your players be guinea pigs to see if they can change, thats your choice. But cant expect us to have trust and faith it will be better, based just on their word that they want to change.


But we can call us lucky. Pro7 will get their grasp on EQ2 (pity on them), and other games like half a year before ps2 will come live. By that time we will see how they handle it, and either begin to trust them, or watch their rotting corpses being ravaged by angry EQ2 mob :)

[Wargrim]

Nothing was swept under the rug. This was of course a negative in this however the potential it could bring our existing and future customers and products I think is severely misunderstood. This is going to provide a level of support for the EU that we have never been able to do. This company will also do television (actual television) marketing that we just don't have the resources to do getting this in front of millions of viewers.

Either way, as stated, they are currently looking at options that will satisfy our existing customers. It's just going to take some time.

I keep reading "existing customers", existing planetside players, existing outfits, and formulations of a similar meaning. What about new players? We have cross - Atlantic friendships too, and want to be able to play on the same server. Will we be able to do it or not?

And jea, Pro7 will be able to deliver massive television marketing, but i am pretty sure most players dont mean that when expressing worries about the quality of support from Pro7. I am pretty sure they mean stuff like
- speed of patches being delivered
- dealing with cheaters/hacks/abuses
- privacy and data security regarding accounts / credit card info
- if Pro7 can set its own prices at the cash shop
- if Pro7 can alter stats of ingame/cash shop items
- if you will still be able to have the direct feedback paths as SoE account holders
And so on.

[Mirror]

Which practice in particular concerned you most?


And jea, Pro7 will be able to deliver massive television marketing, but i am pretty sure most players dont mean that when expressing worries about the quality of support from Pro7. I am pretty sure they mean stuff like
- speed of patches being delivered
- dealing with cheaters/hacks/abuses
- privacy and data security regarding accounts / credit card info
- if Pro7 can set its own prices at the cash shop
- if Pro7 can alter stats of ingame/cash shop items
- if you will still be able to have the direct feedback paths as SoE account holders
And so on.

Can I borrow this? :)

It has been said in another thread or maybe in this one that SOE will be managing game releases, patches and what goes on the shop, which is good. Please remind why I should need to make an account with Pro7 when my current SOE account does that job perfectly just now? Or is this something that is also being discussed?

[Kran De Loy]

I keep reading "existing customers", existing planetside players, existing outfits, and formulations of a similar meaning. What about new players? We have cross - Atlantic friendships too, and want to be able to play on the same server. Will we be able to do it or not?

And jea, Pro7 will be able to deliver massive television marketing, but i am pretty sure most players dont mean that when expressing worries about the quality of support from Pro7. I am pretty sure they mean stuff like
- speed of patches being delivered
- dealing with cheaters/hacks/abuses
- privacy and data security regarding accounts / credit card info
- if Pro7 can set its own prices at the cash shop
- if Pro7 can alter stats of ingame/cash shop items
- if you will still be able to have the direct feedback paths as SoE account holders
And so on.
I'm also really leery about the 'existing customers' part that keeps cropping up. It implies that they will still be keeping the region lock. Just for 'new' players which is pretty much anyone that doesn't already have an account with SOE, I would assume.

I'm utterly dumbfounded on how anyone could be still trying to cling to region locking.
It. Will. Limit. The. Player. Base.
Limiting the players will also limit the cash yield from them. How is this a good idea?

[RadarX]

Can I borrow this? :)

It has been said in another thread or maybe in this one that SOE will be managing game releases, patches and what goes on the shop, which is good. Please remind why I should need to make an account with Pro7 when my current SOE account does that job perfectly just now? Or is this something that is also being discussed?

I can't speculate what is being discussed beyond they are looking into a way that region locking will either be different than the original plan or unnecessary. It's also less complex for folks who speak English. If you don't? You have no access to a Community Manager or developer.

I think I've done enough cheerleading which wasn't my original intent. I just want to ensure everyone understands the facts and knows we are fully cognoscente of player concerns.

[Wakken]

i really hope they just integrate Pro7 with SOE and let us all use our SOE accounts, pro7 for the marketing and we all buy from SOE's shop.

I will personally just go with SOE if possible. I dont want to create a account nor join Pro7's community. And I dont want to buy stuff from their shop, I dont trust them at all

EU just seem like a second hand customer (again), exactly what happened with the other games I've played that had a EU and US community with a EU partner. EU just being dragged along.

I wont make the same mistake again

[Kran De Loy]

Had to say it twice it was so appreciated.

[Kran De Loy]

I can't speculate what is being discussed beyond they are looking into a way that region locking will either be different than the original plan or unnecessary. It's also less complex for folks who speak English. If you don't? You have no access to a Community Manager or developer.

I think I've done enough cheerleading which wasn't my original intent. I just want to ensure everyone understands the facts and knows we are fully cognoscente of player concerns.

Thank you absolute tons for showing up and doing that much. Having someone with some clout (ie: blue name and oj text) dropping by to comment is very much appreciated by everyone, I'm sure.

[Mastachief]

By the way RadarX we do appreciate your interaction with us and for that matter all the soe/planetside 2 teams interaction with us.

We just have a strong distaste to have to have some third party account for a SOE game after almost 10 years of giving SOE money. 9 years of payments for 2 accounts in my case thats around $3000 including buying the game and core combat for both accounts. If I am to now play planetside 2 for another decade I would like to think that this sort of money would go directly into funding the games developement rather than some newbie tv station (by the way a 12year old tv company is a new tv company compared to say the bbc and independent tv in the UK or even bskyb).

Concerns such as the customer service teams being recruited from school children that currently play their farmville type games which would lead to these people having little or no understanding of our game and if they are not native language speakers (ie I'm german but i can speak english and spanish.) leading to miscommunication and fustration.

The patch stuff, I want my game to run at the same time as the u.s version i don't want to wait 4 weeks while pro7 convert it to 12 different languages.

The shop, Security and price equalisation. If sony self a Higby wig in the shop for $10 i want to pay what ever $10 is in my currency (£ so thats £6.66) i dont want to pay £10 or if pro7 decide £20.

I want to be able to give feedback to SOE directly regards bugs and development.

I want to be able to partake in SOE run Test server sessions (should they be held)

I want to forum whore with the U.S player base (half the fun was Forumside)

I want my U.S outfit members to be able to play with us and if we can to recruit more that like to play euroside due to work or location limitations on their play time.

I want to be able to (like i did last weekend) promote SOE and planetside2 to the LAN events i attend without having to go "by this game is great but you need to create an account with some random german company to play"

[Wargrim]

We really appreciate the bits of information you gave us RadarX.

I am pretty sure you already delivered the message to the higher ranks, but it cant be said often enough: The best approach to regional locking is to not have it at all. If the original plans included it, said plans should be flushed down the proverbial toilet, for the better of of the game, the community, and everyone.

[basti]

I can't speculate what is being discussed beyond they are looking into a way that region locking will either be different than the original plan or unnecessary. It's also less complex for folks who speak English. If you don't? You have no access to a Community Manager or developer.

I think I've done enough cheerleading which wasn't my original intent. I just want to ensure everyone understands the facts and knows we are fully cognoscente of player concerns.

Whats to discuss there? Region locking is unnecessary one way or another, and will only cost customers, with literally no gain at all for us, you or Pro7. Let people decide themself if they want to play under Pro7 or SOE, even if its outside their actual region. A single message that pops up when you register for one of the two from the region that is not intended for it (in other words, if a Euro registers for the US, or a US registers for the Euro) would be more than enough. Tell them that there is a different service for their region that provides support in their language as well has servers physically closer to them (better ping) and propably even servers in their language, and leave it that way.

You simply cannot force players to play under Pro7 if they dont want to. Instead of giving them the choice of Pro7 or SOE, you give them the choice of Pro7 or no game. And if they dont want Pro7, then its no game for them, means no cash for you.
Yea, i know, i simplify the whole thing by a lot, and the whole topic is much more complicated. But the way i wrote it is the way most players will see it.

PS: Radar, its saturday. You guys make a fantastic job at trying to get us happy again, but go take a break, or we drive ya crazy at some point. ;)

[Kran De Loy]

... the whole topic is much more complicated. But the way i wrote it is the way most players will see it.

Yes.

[UnknownDT]

We do love you RadarX. Just in case that point got lost in translation earlier in the thread.

<3

[Mirror]

I can't speculate what is being discussed beyond they are looking into a way that region locking will either be different than the original plan or unnecessary. It's also less complex for folks who speak English. If you don't? You have no access to a Community Manager or developer.

I think I've done enough cheerleading which wasn't my original intent. I just want to ensure everyone understands the facts and knows we are fully cognoscente of player concerns.

I know that you guys are and although it's been said everyone appreciates the extra work on here that you are putting in.

So how big a deal do we make it when our community manager is a Pro7 employee? :p

[RadarX]

I hope no one took my text as me getting offended. I've been doing this long enough that is ridiculously hard to do. I'm just not in the habit of talking without a purpose. My primary goal was to provide a little more communication than you had seen this week and let everyone know we really are reading all this.

Mirror you should make it a huge deal. Whoever that is got the choicest assignment there. Just sayin...

[Bags]

Yay for RadarX~

[Mightymouser]

You simply cannot force players to play under Pro7 if they dont want to. Instead of giving them the choice of Pro7 or SOE, you give them the choice of Pro7 or no game. And if they dont want Pro7, then its no game for them, means no cash for you.
Yea, i know, i simplify the whole thing by a lot, and the whole topic is much more complicated. But the way i wrote it is the way most players will see it.


Just to play devil's advocate here basti, you're forgetting that Pro7 has to agree to this deal as well... If SOE gives everyone the 'choice' to use Pro7 or SOE, that cuts into Pro7's profit margins(possibly quite deeply); meanwhile they're still supposed to be providing a media front for the game in Europe. Cutting them out of the loop entirely probably isn't something they're going to want to agree to, at least not without SOE sending more funding their way.

(Obviously I have no idea what the agreement is/was, but:) I would imagine that Pro7 signed on to provide media and community support (as well as servers) with the understanding that they would be the ones making the loin's share of the money off of the Euro subscribers they bring in; so if there is a loop-hole there that allows SOE to make that money instead, Pro7's probably not going to be very happy about that, and I imagine that is what is being hammered out...

[basti]

Just to play devil's advocate here basti, you're forgetting that Pro7 has to agree to this deal as well... If SOE gives everyone the 'choice' to use Pro7 or SOE, that cuts into Pro7's profit margins(possibly quite deeply); meanwhile they're still supposed to be providing a media front for the game in Europe. Cutting them out of the loop entirely probably isn't something they're going to want to agree to, at least not without SOE sending more funding their way.

(Obviously I have no idea what the agreement is/was, but:) I would imagine that Pro7 signed on to provide media and community support (as well as servers) with the understanding that they would be the ones making the loin's share of the money off of the Euro subscribers they bring in; so if there is a loop-hole there that allows SOE to make that money instead, Pro7's probably not going to be very happy about that, and I imagine that is what is being hammered out...

With a region lock, they would literally cut themself out.
Its not a question of Pro7 or SOE, its a question of SOE or no game for a lot of people.
To build trust, one needs time, and efford. They pretty much fucked themself up with that region lock thingy. Its what happens if you have people thinking 2 much about the money and not enough about the customers. The key point is: Money happens all by itself when your customers are happy.

[Mightymouser]

With a region lock, they would literally cut themself out.
Its not a question of Pro7 or SOE, its a question of SOE or no game for a lot of people.
To build trust, one needs time, and efford. They pretty much fucked themself up with that region lock thingy.

Well, clearly Pro7 doesn't really see it that way; I mean they agreed to the deal with the understanding that people would want to play, and would want to play on their servers. To be honest, I would imagine they were working under the assumption that most players don't see it playing on Pro7 server's as a deal-breaker... Obviously the outcry has caused them to re-evaluate a bit, but I would still imagine they would be rather hesitant to allow anyone who wanted to to opt-out of paying them, in favor of paying SOE.

(Again this is speculation, but:) I would predict that the best compromise we can hope for is that existing subscribers will be able to be grandfathered onto SOEs servers in the new system, thus allowing existing communities to stay together, while ensuring Pro7 has a solid revenue stream, and a reasonable incentive to bring players to their games' servers. Still though, that means Pro7 is looking at fewer subscribers than expected, and that means it's going to take time to work out the deal so they don't feel shafted, and also so that SOE isn't paying crazy fees to subsidize these players on their servers...

[Sta]

Internet was always about freedom of choice!!

As long as you dont try to tell me what Ive to do or like everything is fine.

But this whole separation attempt simply leans in the opposite direction regarding my freedom to do what ever I like with my free time...

:usa:

[Vancha]

With a region lock, they would literally cut themself out.
Its not a question of Pro7 or SOE, its a question of SOE or no game for a lot of people.
To build trust, one needs time, and efford. They pretty much fucked themself up with that region lock thingy. Its what happens if you have people thinking 2 much about the money and not enough about the customers. The key point is: Money happens all by itself when your customers are happy.
This. Absolutely this.

At least with SOE we have prior experience. We know they can't allow themselves to succeed. As a friend of mine put it so eloquently today, "they have a history of treading on their own dick".

With PSS1 however, my initial experience of them consists of them prioritizing their greed over customer satisfaction. They've already tried to screw us over in order to make a buck. A good company makes money by pleasing it's customers, not by giving them no other choice.

[RedKnights]

I hope no one took my text as me getting offended. I've been doing this long enough that is ridiculously hard to do. I'm just not in the habit of talking without a purpose. My primary goal was to provide a little more communication than you had seen this week and let everyone know we really are reading all this.

Mirror you should make it a huge deal. Whoever that is got the choicest assignment there. Just sayin...

/engage campaign for Radar X as Head PS2 Community Manager

[dachlatte]

The key point is: Money happens all by itself when your customers are happy.
you dont need to care about your customers if you have a monopoly. just sayin...

[DayOne]

you dont need to care about your customers if you have a monopoly. just sayin...

But they don't have a monopoly.

[Kran De Loy]

Okay, so Region Locking was in the original plans. This means that they can and will confirm where a player is when they log into PS2 and limit that person to the selected servers for their area based on that detection.

So PSS1 and SOE can for certain, beyond doubt, know where the person is either in the EU or US or wherever.

Why not make the in-game browser or a terminal in the game world where people can shop for items and stuff, or something similar that just sends the player to the appropriate cash shop for their region instead of having to lock the entire server go that region? It's a far fairer business model for the players and the companies get what they want still.

[dachlatte]

But they don't have a monopoly.

if they keep that regin lock, then yes they do

[General M]

EU beta/access for EU players into beta?

[Boomzor]

While I understand that customer support in any form offered in the native language of the ticket holder is intended in our best interest, my personal experience from this practice has been less than stellar. Examples of games would include (but not limited to) Lineage 2, RF-Online (both Korean -> western) and WaR (US -> EU).

While I thoroughly enjoy being able to understand what the csr is saying and know that the csr understands what I'm saying, there is always the issues of what they are allowed to say. In all of the above games, EU customers eventually hit a wall in the chain of information that always meant "we can't tell you until we get word from parent company". That would be word from SOE in PS2.

Pretty much all support will need extra steps to eventually reach the customer, meaning EU will suffer longer from exploits not being discovered and hot-fixed fast enough.

It is REALLY REALLY important that pro7 has a 24/7 access to the relevant information through enough SOE representatives until they've managed to find the proper working pace to handle stuff on their own *to the satisfaction of their customers*. This step has nearly always failed before.

Also, in the FAQ there's a passage that read
Looking ahead, SOE and ProSiebenSat.1 Games will closely monitor the needs and wishes of local communities to bring special content as appropriate to European players.

Especially the "special content as appropriate to European players" were read by many sceptics on the fence as a free pass for them to continue wrecking game balance as they see fit. That needs to be removed, reworded and clarified.

Just remember, a beaten wife will never forget the abuse, no matter how often you say you won't do it again.

[Coreldan]

It has been said in two different occasions now that "as far as we know" EU players shouldnt be restricted from beta from SOEs behalf.

[Trolltaxi]

It has been said in two different occasions now that "as far as we know" EU players shouldnt be restricted from beta from SOEs behalf.

Screw the beta, make sure EU players will play the game balanced by SOE - like the rest of the world!

[Kran De Loy]

It has been said in two different occasions now that "as far as we know" EU players shouldnt be restricted from beta from SOEs behalf.

I think it was more like, they had no plans to have it restricted so it was more like a, "*Shrug* Ya'll shouldn't have ta worry, but really we dun know for sure yet."

Screw the beta, make sure EU players will play the game balanced by SOE - like the rest of the world!

Yes. Tens of thousands times something along those lines have been said by thousands of people.
Best answer we've gotten back is again something like, 'We'll see what we can do.' Which is flat out pitiful, tbh.
Better than nothing, but still ridiculous. I still strongly support someone smacking the guy responsible for the segregation in the first place. Just WHAP right up hte back of the head.

[UnknownDT]

All I know is my life will end if I can't play tickle in game with Mirror anymore ;(

[Mirror]

All I know is my life will end if I can't play tickle in game with Mirror anymore ;(

:love:

[RedKnights]

We've come up with a plan to allow ALL players to play on any servers they want. More details to follow.
-j_Smedley's Twitter.


Looks like something is afoot today! :D

Does this mean I can resub? Will DT still be as British? Stay tuned to find out.

[RadarX]

Looks like something is afoot today! :D

Does this mean I can resub? Will DT still be as British? Stay tuned to find out.

More information is coming later.

[basti]

More information is coming later.

Laters, as today?

[Wakken]

Laters, as today?

"Soon."

[UnknownDT]

"Soon."

one ring to rule them all