Will New Content Thin Numbers?

[PoisonTaco]

I never played the original Planetside so I have no idea if they added any new continents or not over the game's life. Either way let's speculate a bit here.

So Planetside 2 is going to have three continents at launch and each continent can have 666 players per faction. That's just two shy of 2000. So based off of that, each server can handle a max population of 6000. What happens when SOE adds a new continent? Now we have 6000 players on a server that can handle 8000.

If the game continues to grow, all is well and good as everyone gets their friends on board. But as we add new continents and playable space it could potentially thin servers out as time goes on and the game could potentially lose its massive feel to it.

Anyways, food for thought.

[NivexQ]

Not every continent was fought on at all times in Planetside.

[Stardouser]

I think this is very much a non issue, and at any rate, it's no reason to intentionally handicap the game from diversifying and adding new content.

Also, beta will prove one way or the other, but I think it's going to be very player dense early on; and we will welcome it when the game can handle 8000 per server but the servers are populated from when it was 6000.

[The Kush]

Yea when new continents are added I hope they add sanctuaries back in the game.

[Raymac]

It's a good question. The only time they added content to PS1 was the caves, and those weren't exactly very popular. Now a whole new continent will be extremely popular. There are 2 ways I can think of dealing with this:

1. Return poplocks to funnel the players together. Personally I don't like this idea because I always felt poplocks created the most downtime in the game. I know people like the meta game of "winning" a continent, but the lead up to the actual lock was about 30 mins of 9:1 odds, followed by another 30 mins of starting a new fight somewhere else. (But that's a whole other thread)

2. Server merges. I think this is far more likely since server merges are basically inevitable in MMOs. Server merges will happen so they might as well happen at the same time that new content is released. That should help with the perception that the game is "dying" that server merges tend to convey.

[Sabot]

Completely new, never heard of continents I dont think they will add for a very long time. Those will most certainly be full at all times... I'm guessing the old conts in new packaging ala PS2 will also be very popular when they go live, but not like a completely new one.

[zomg]

I have a feeling that changes in the maps at release will be more prominent than actually bringing in whole new maps. They have talked about how their tooling is much better and allows designers to do their thing nicely.

I think it would be cool if they had sort of events or such that would change the terrain. Let's imagine there's a space battle and a starship crashes or something and now that's in one of the sectors. (PS noob, honestly I have no idea if there are space battles in the Planetside "lore" or not but it felt like a nice example anyway :D )

[Otleaz]

I hope they plan ahead for server mergers. That would make things go much smoother later on.

[Silencer22]

In the original PS, I think most people would tend to go to where the action and biggest fights were occurring. So I think the pop balance would likely work itself out. You will have some smaller scale fighting on some continents and then a few larger fights where the bulk of the people will be.

[bjorntju1]

I think Smed talked about having multiple planets (and on that planets different continents) later on in the game. This way you play on one server, but technically every planet is its own server.

[QuantumMechanic]

This is a very good point. TRay has mentioned they have plans to add back all continents from the original game, and you can be sure this won't happen with just a single update. The game world will likely steadily expand over a period of years.

PS2 won't have the usual MMORPG "problem" that all the high level characters will only be in the "new lands" and new characters will be in the "newbie lands". But I don't necessarily see server population increasing with the new continents being added. If anything only temporarily as old players return to check out the new continents and then return to play BF4 or whatever.

I would like to hear other people's potential solutions. The only thing that makes sense to me is server merges as Raymac suggested. When done in the context of increasing a server's population limit above and beyond what it used to be, I don't think a server merge has any negative connotation to it at all. In fact it's something people should get excited about.

[Stardouser]

I think server merges is probably a good solution, but, what I want to say above all else is that the population density of a server does not need to be so dense that there is fighting going on everywhere at once. If there are 9 continents and 2 are left without fighting sometimes, that's fine. Provides options to players.

[RadarX]

We've gotten really good at keeping numbers where they need to be. I assure you all this has been considered.

[Stardouser]

We've gotten really good at keeping numbers where they need to be. I assure you all this has been considered.

Are we going to be able to relax a bit when we get to more continents or will numbers be kept so dense there will be substantial combat on every continent at all times?

[Geist]

I believe they mentioned that they are definitely putting in new continents post launch such as Searhus, but it might take a while.

My hope is that once there are more continents, Empires can actually have the ability to capture continents.

[Mirror]

I think SOE have learned a lot over the years and aim to avoid repeating mistakes from Planetside 1 that made the majority of people unsub.


edit: omg I forgot some rather important words.

[SergeantNubins]

It wont be a problem, as in ps1, people go to where the fights are, and you arent going to sturggle with 6000 players spread over an 8000 player area.

More continents will hopefully bring back one aspect of ps1 that I have a feeling we might actually miss from PS2, which is the build up and cool down of battles. WHen you opened up on a new continent and raced to get your footholds in before the enemy defenders could respond en masse and overrun you and the chilled moments when the enemy were defeated and finally had to bug out, all that was left was for you and your buddies to dick about team killing each other and go get a cuppa... just chill for a 15 minutes or so.. sounds strange, but after a 4-8 hour long and pretty intense battle, it was kinda nice :)

[Crator]

So a single server to the player is actually a shard of servers in the back end. Meaning there is more then one server running for the one server the players see. I'd imagine there will be a population limit for each continent. If they add more continents to the game it would expand the total amount of population on a single player server. I've always viewed the limit of population to a cont, not the the entire server. AmIRight?

[RadarX]

Are we going to be able to relax a bit when we get to more continents or will numbers be kept so dense there will be substantial combat on every continent at all times?

Player balance is obviously crucial for good gameplay and we will do whatever we can to ensure that stays strong. It's hard to outline specifics with things as fluid as they are right now. We need some good stress testing from you folks to see what needs to happen.

[ringring]

Are we going to be able to relax a bit when we get to more continents or will numbers be kept so dense there will be substantial combat on every continent at all times?
From experience on PS1 there is no need for there to be substantial combat on all continents. People will naturally move to the fight they want to be at.
What's more, open areas will aid the meta-game enormously and my particular concern is the opposite to the OP's, that there is not enough fighting space.

[Stardouser]

From experience on PS1 there is no need for there to be substantial combat on all continents. People will naturally move to the fight they want to be at.
What's more, open areas will aid the meta-game enormously and my particular concern is the opposite to the OP's, that there is not enough fighting space.

Sounds like we're looking for the same thing. I mean, don't get me wrong - for the first 6 months, I understand there will be some sardine canning since we only have 3 continents and we don't want to have to have any more servers than necessary - but I would like to be able to look forward to a little bit of breathing room coming with the extra continents.

And yea- more open areas means more strategies for the meta-game. Actually, that's probably my biggest concern. If there's combat everywhere at once, how would that allow for a meta-game?

[Traenor]

You also have to remember that the changed business model, F2P, will mean that a constant stream of new players will probably happen if this game is moderately succesful, which i am sure it will in the least.

[Professor Frink]

In the original PS, I think most people would tend to go to where the action and biggest fights were occurring.

Exactly. If there is a big battle going on we will all head that way.

[Red Beard]

We've gotten really good at keeping numbers where they need to be. I assure you all this has been considered.

Anyone notice he couldn't claim this without a populated server? :cool2:

[Otleaz]

Anyone notice he couldn't claim this without a populated server? :cool2:

EQ, EQ2, PS1

Those were all populated at one point I believe.

[Serotriptomine]

The only suggestion I could reiterate in good conscious would be to be PREPARED, for server merging @ devs. It might not happen for weeks, months, a year, but WHEN IT DOES, the process does NOT need to take 1-3 months to complete.

[IHateMMOs]

I hope Amerish will have the rest of the facility types when it comes out. I have a bad feeling that some continents you'll have to purchase as a DLC in order to play on. Getting a chill down my spine.

[ringring]

I hope Amerish will have the rest of the facility types when it comes out. I have a bad feeling that some continents you'll have to purchase as a DLC in order to play on. Getting a chill down my spine.

Actually Smedley said no to that in his recent interview.

[Nasher]

I doubt server merges will be needed for a very long time. Being free to play it's always going to have tonnes of players, because you can drop in and out as you like and it costs nothing.

...And yea, making new continents and major content updates paid for DLC would be a game killer, since half would buy it and half wouldn't. Split communities in MMOs never work and ALWAYS end in people quitting (like we saw with core combat in PS1)

[xnorb]

Whenever possible i'll stay away from the clusterfucks.
I know many love that, but i'd rather fight a 4on4 over a small installment
over an hour than a 200on200 meatgrinding base fight.

[Stardouser]

Whenever possible i'll stay away from the clusterfucks.
I know many love that, but i'd rather fight a 4on4 over a small installment
over an hour than a 200on200 meatgrinding base fight.

If they managed to put 2000 into a continent, I don't expect that 4 on 4 will happen a lot. Maybe it will when we have more breathing room from more continents.

Well buddy, if you find many 4v4 fights SOE has failed to do their jobs. But I agree in principle with what you are saying. Can't stand zerging much myself.

And yet, wait a second. We're going to have US servers and EU servers, the split like that will mean that for the most part, EU servers will wind down a bit at night and same for US servers. So how will time of day affect numbers? Will server/continent populations only get big on weekends, or weekdays from 4PM EST/1PST to 4AM EST/1AM PST?(just making the assumption that PST guys will play at least to around 1AM and EST will start about 4PM)

And does that mean that in the mornings and early day you can find your small battles?

[Stardouser]

Well this is where US having east and west coast servers helped. I have no idea what they plan for PS2 but I do know there is no region locking. Have to see how it plays out.

When you say "helped" do you mean that having a clearly demarcated peak time is a good thing? I'm not saying it isn't, just wondering what you meant.

[RageMasterUK]

2000 players / 64 square km = 31.25 players per square kilometer if evenly distributed.

4 on 4 will happen because you can directly influence it!

If you want that type of fight you just need to take your 3 mates to try and back-hack something empty away from the main conflict zone. Eventually defenders will turn up. You will get your 4 on 4. Atleast for a while :D

Your skirmish might generate interest from friends and enemies. Before you know it the territory you are in might become the no.1 flashpoint on the continent. If you still want your 4 vs 4 at that stage you can fly somewhere else and set up again :D

For me this is what makes Planetside epic. That you can be fighting a rather subdued battle one moment, and end up in the biggest battle of the continent, without changing position. That a 4 v 4 can become an 8 v 8, and then a 32 v 32 v 32 when the other empire catches on. Then a clusterfuck. And the satisfaction of being there from the beginning and in some cases knowing you were the cause of such massive activity around that area.

When you lean back in your chair, look at the furball of aircraft and malestrom of explosions on your monitor and say "I MAED THIS!!" :D

-RageMasterUK

[IHateMMOs]

Actually Smedley said no to that in his recent interview.

No to what? The other facilities or the continents being available to everyone.

[Neo Hope]

He said no to paid DLC.
it will thin the player balance out:

We sell DLC in our game, DC Universe Online. That’s great. In PlanetSide 2 we’re making a conscious choice not to sell maps. Why? Because we want the community to stick together. If you look at Battlefield 3 or Modern Warfare 3, or actually the time immemorial of FPSes, here’s what happens. Everybody plays the base game. DLC comes. 80 percent pick that up. DLC comes. 70 percent pick that up. And so on and so on. Two years later, you don’t know what map packs people have and it ends up costing quite a bit in terms of how you get into the ones that people are playing, because you have to buy various DLCs. But for us, with a persistent game world, we don’t want to split up people. We need them in there, because the community doesn’t work without that. It’s pretty basic.

http://venturebeat.com/2012/06/18/sonys-free-to-play-online-shooter-planetside-2-will-pack-2000-players-in-an-arena-interview/2/

[Xaine]

If anything, more conts will make it more interesting. :)

[Sturmhardt]

Every continent will pretty sure be its own instanced server, so they could just lift the popcap for the whole server when new continents appear. Technically its not an issue.

[Sephirex]

Every continent will pretty sure be its own instanced server, so they could just lift the popcap for the whole server when new continents appear. Technically its not an issue.

Pretty much. They could probably pull a Everquest and just swell this thing to massive proportions given enough time. Underwater, In-Space, on the moon, back in time.

Then we'll all just be reminiscing of the good ol' days of 3 continents.

[Redshift]

They won't gate content so no one will be unable to follow a fight, and if they add new conts they'll just lie dormant until attacked, the fight doesn't spread out it just moves sometimes

[NapalmEnima]

They won't gate content so no one will be unable to follow a fight, and if they add new conts they'll just lie dormant until attacked, the fight doesn't spread out it just moves sometimes

On the contrary. PS2 should be able to sustain combat on all continents all the time. Remember: Every empire has an uncap-able foothold on each continent. No lattice here.

Though I suppose that could change on new continents.

Of course PS1 didn't have the lattice system at release either. We'll see.

[Redshift]

On the contrary. PS2 should be able to sustain combat on all continents all the time.

yes that's true, but the OP was asking about new conts spreading out a player base. If a server has a finite player base then adding more continents will cause either spread out fights or dormant continents, i was telling him from the first game's experiences it will probably be dormant conts.

[Sephirex]

yes that's true, but the OP was asking about new conts spreading out a player base. If a server has a finite player base then adding more continents will cause either spread out fights or dormant continents, i was telling him from the first game's experiences it will probably be dormant conts.

If they organize their architecture right, they could increase the player cap with each new continent.

[Trignite]

http://venturebeat.com/2012/06/18/sonys-free-to-play-online-shooter-planetside-2-will-pack-2000-players-in-an-arena-interview/2/


We’ve nailed it.

Oh no not again :lol:

[Redshift]

If they organize their architecture right, they could increase the player cap with each new continent.

i kinda just worry about each cont essentially being a server and the choices between wear to fight no different to selecting a server, they way it sounds atm it doesn't sound very organic

[Sephirex]

i kinda just worry about each cont essentially being a server and the choices between wear to fight no different to selecting a server, they way it sounds atm it doesn't sound very organic

Pretty much on par with PS1. As long as they keep a strong hub, and keep the continents linked together in a way that simulates a world, they should be fine.

[LegioX]

Just make 1 big ass planet and have continents or "maps" all over it for people to play and fight on. Whoever controls the world and captures all continents is the winner.

Simple?

[Sledgecrushr]

i kinda just worry about each cont essentially being a server and the choices between wear to fight no different to selecting a server, they way it sounds atm it doesn't sound very organic

Well i think this whole idea of playing on just one server is kind of old fashioned. Auaxis will be comprisd of three seperate servers basically.

[Sledgecrushr]

Just make 1 big ass planet and have continents or "maps" all over it for people to play and fight on. Whoever controls the world and captures all continents is the winner.

Simple?

My idea is kind of similar, but instead of just capturing continents you could capture entire worlds. Well implemented server transfers FTW.

[Stardouser]

Just make 1 big ass planet and have continents or "maps" all over it for people to play and fight on. Whoever controls the world and captures all continents is the winner.

Simple?

The only problem with that would be the problem of 5000 guys spawning or going to the same spot and crashing the server.

But; Planetside won't be the only viable MMOFPS forever and I suspect that competitors, at least not all of them, will not use the continent approach to slice up a server. There have GOT to be other ways.

[Sephirex]

The only problem with that would be the problem of 5000 guys spawning or going to the same spot and crashing the server.

But; Planetside won't be the only viable MMOFPS forever and I suspect that competitors, at least not all of them, will not use the continent approach to slice up a server. There have GOT to be other ways.

That's why there's a 2K cap per area?

So far modern competitors have used a central hub approach with fighting taking place in instanced matches of 24-64 people. Anyone can always step their game up in the future, but right now PS2 is looking like top dog.

[LegioX]

The only problem with that would be the problem of 5000 guys spawning or going to the same spot and crashing the server.

But; Planetside won't be the only viable MMOFPS forever and I suspect that competitors, at least not all of them, will not use the continent approach to slice up a server. There have GOT to be other ways.

Go in more depth with it. Have a menu or some type of HUD system, which shows actions/resources/supply links from all continents. Then people and squads can choose what to do and how to attack different sections.

[Stardouser]

That's why there's a 2K cap per area?

So far modern competitors have used a central hub approach with fighting taking place in instanced matches of 24-64 people. Anyone can always step their game up in the future, but right now PS2 is looking like top dog.

Yes, that is why there is a 2K cap per area. What I'm saying is that there have GOT to be other ways that no one has thought of yet.

But you know, I suspect even 2000 people on the same point could crash the server. I'm betting the mission system, while it plays a primary role in immersion and teamwork encouragement, plays a secondary role in keeping all 2000 players from going to the same point. I don't remember when but one of the SOE guys described missions as filling up to the point where they would no longer be advertised although if a friend invites you to it you could still join. I immediately thought of this issue when I heard that.

[Sephirex]

Yes, that is why there is a 2K cap per area. What I'm saying is that there have GOT to be other ways that no one has thought of yet.

Oh I'm sure there's ways. But no company's willing to put the dollars in to research tech for an untested business model.

That's why all the new MMO's are hotbar clickfests, with the company's swearing in interviews that's the best today's tech allows.

That's why I hope PS2 succeeds. Maybe the rest of the online industry will get off their collective ass and start looking at new ways to build their worlds. Hell, I'd give my first born for a persistent Star Wars Battlefront, but as SWTOR and Force Unleashed proves, Lucasarts won't greenlight shit until someone else does it first.

[Sifer2]

I imagine it really be as simple as them merging servers after launch when they add more continents/planets. I also expect some kind of way to jump ahead of others in the que to enter a specific continent will be a premium feature.