Considering Purchase: Good deal/How will it run?

[Soyokaze]

I'm currently considering purchasing the following build for $763.00. My question is a) is this a good performance/$ value and b) how well will it run PS2?

Case 1 x ARC CS-501 Gaming Case-Black
Processor 1 x AMD FX-4100 CPU (4x 3.60GHz/4MB L2 Cache)
Motherboard 1 x ASUS M5A97 -- AMD 970
Memory 1 x 8 GB [4 GB X2] DDR3-1600 Memory Module-G.Skill Ripjaws X
Video Card 1 x NVIDIA GeForce GT 640 - 2GB
Power Supply 1 x 550 Watt - Standard
Processor Cooling 1 x Liquid CPU Cooling System [AMD]-Standard 120mm Fan
Video Card Brand 1 x Major Brand Powered by AMD or NVIDIA
Primary Hard Drive 1 x 120 GB ADATA S510 SSD-Single Drive
Optical Drive 1 x 24X Dual Format/Double Layer DVD±R/±RW + CD-R/RW Drive-Black
Sound Card 1 x 3D Premium Surround Sound Onboard
Network Card 1 x Onboard LAN Network (Gb or 10/100)
Operating System 1 x Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium + Office Starter 2010 (Includes basic versions of Word and Excel)-64-Bit
Warranty 1 x 3 Year Standard Warranty Service
Rush Service 1 x Rush Service Fee (not shipping fee)-No Rush Service, Estimate Ship Out in 5~10 Business Days
iBUYPOWER PowerDrive 1 x PowerDrive Level 2 - Up to 20% Overclocking
Motherboard USB / SATA Interface 1 x Motherboard default USB / SATA Interface

[Goku]

http://www.planetside-universe.com/showthread.php?t=37183

Answer those.

No AMD 4100 FX either. Bad processor.

Oh this is prebuilt. Still answering that helps.

[Pancake]

The main features to worry about for gaming are GPU, CPU and Memory. I will analyze these components on your build.

GPU: BAD. The 460 outperforms the 640 by a wide margin and is only $10 more. (http://www.hwcompare.com/12847/geforce-gt-640-ddr3-vs-geforce-gtx-460-1gb/)

CPU: Alright for the price point. However, an i3 2100 would work out to be the same price but would have better performance (http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/fx-4100-core-i3-2100-gaming-benchmark,3136-9.html).

Memory: Excellent! I have G.Skills and they perform extremely well and it is the most reliable brand.

[Bags]

Remember that's just theorhetical, pancake. Though the 460 is probably better.

[Rbstr]

An AMD CPU is pretty much a bad idea unless you're trying to build something very cheap that isn't going to be playing games.
That graphics card isn't recommended either.
And there's no need at all for water cooling at stock(ish) CPU speeds.

120GB SSD is nice...but the only disk in the computer?

For a new gaming computer I'd say as a minimum:
Intel i3 2100
GTX460
8GB ram


Here's something in your budget that I threw together...including Windows 7 @ $100(link (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148529)):
Motherboard: An AsRock Z77, $100 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157297
RAM: 8gb (2x4gb) DDR1600 $50 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148476
CPU: i3 2100 (3.1ghz, dual core) $110 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115078
Graphics: GTX 560 $210 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130662 (if you run lower resolution on your monitor you could get by with a GTX460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130749) $140)
Hard drive: 500GB Samsung $80 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152181
PSU: Corsair 500w, $50 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139027
Case: $50 for this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042
DVD drive: $15 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151244

$780 $10 in shipping. $709 with the GTX460. There's some rebates I haven't included.
Better in every category except the SSD.
Here's a 128gb SSD http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148529. Adds $40 if you remove the 500gb I listed.

[Ailos]

Here's something in your budget that I threw together...including Windows 7 @ $100(link (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148529)):
Motherboard: An AsRock Z77, $100 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813157297
RAM: 8gb (2x4gb) DDR1600 $50 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148476
CPU: i3 2100 (3.1ghz, dual core) $110 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115078
Graphics: GTX 560 $210 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130662 (if you run lower resolution on your monitor you could get by with a GTX460 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814130749) $140)
Hard drive: 500GB Samsung $80 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152181
PSU: Corsair 500w, $50 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817139027
Case: $50 for this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129042
DVD drive: $15 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151244

$780 $10 in shipping. $709 with the GTX460. There's some rebates I haven't included.
Better in every category except the SSD.
Here's a 128gb SSD http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820148529. Adds $40 if you remove the 500gb I listed.

This.

[Soyokaze]

1. What is your budget and does that include shipping/taxes?

I'd prefer to stay under $800

2. Where do you live (Please list if possible town, state, and country)?

Hattiesburg, Mississippi

3. What do you need this computer to do (like gaming, Photoshop, and so on)?

Run games and work on games, primarily in UDK / Unity

4. What parts will you need for the computer? Please list what parts specifically?

Everything but monitor, keyboard, & mouse which I can salvage.

5. Are you reusing any parts for this computer? If so please say what parts.

All save for the above.

6. What kind of monitor/resolution do you have or want to get to use for the computer?

I'll be using a 9 year old CRT monitor for now, upgrading later.

7. Do you have a legit OS? If so what OS and is it 32-bit or 64-bit?
No

8. What are you looking for the motherboard to have feature wise? Like SLI, Crossfire, Firewire, USB 3.0, Sata 6.0 Gb/s, and so on.
As much expansion room as possible at the price level, but I don't plan on using multiple cards or anything. SATA so I can use a relatively small SSD in tandem with a larger traditional harddrive without much trouble.

9. Any plans to overclock the CPU or GPU?
Not really. Don't want to break anything.

[Soyokaze]

By changing to the http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.972954 power supply and GeIL Black Dragon 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Desktop Memory Model GB38GB1333C9DC RAM (no significant difference, right) to get some combos in, I've gotten the above build (SSD variant, GTX 460) down to $713.91

So, that sound like a good value? No mistakes being made on the old checkout button?

[Vancha]

That PSU is a mistake. Stick with the Corsair...The last component you want to gamble with is the PSU, since that can take your whole system with it if it's bad.

[Soyokaze]

Okay, thanks

Changed that back, and upgraded to a 560se, bringing me to $751.91

Also, as far as i can tell this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128502 mobo would only make a difference of $5 more in bundle, would net me money in a rebate, and would allow me to go SLI in the future if I wanted to grow the sys.

Sounding good?

[Vancha]

Sounding good. Link the 560se, plus I'd ask what resolution you're currently using and if you know what you plan to upgrade to (I'm guessing 1900x1080).

Also be aware that 120gb isn't going to go very far.

Edit: http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813128498 Same price with rebates and better still.

[Pancake]

GeIL Black Dragon 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1333 (PC3 10666) Desktop Memory Model GB38GB1333C9DC RAM

I would recommend HIGHLY recommend going with G.Skill Ripjaw X's. They are $5 more but will give you a significant performance boost (12800 vs 10666). Well worth the money.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231428

[Vancha]

They are $5 more but will give you a significant performance boost (12800 vs 10666). Well worth the money.
Source?

[Goku]

Here is what I came up with:

SAMSUNG 22X DVD Burner - $14.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16827151244)
Antec Gaming Series One Mid Tower - $49.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16811129181)
Samsung by Seagate Spinpoint F3 500GB - $79.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16822152181)
SAPPHIRE Radeon HD 7850 OC 2GB - $249.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814102984)
Antec NEO ECO 520C 520W - $59.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16817371030)
G.SKILL Value Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 - $39.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16820231424)
Microsoft Windows 7 Home Premium SP1 64-bit - $99.99 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832116986)
Intel Core i3-2100/GIGABYTE GA-H61MA-D3V Combo - $156.98 (http://www.newegg.com/Product/ComboDealDetails.aspx?ItemList=Combo.955090)

Total = $751.91

I don't really see any reason for getting a higher end mobo here due to how you are not overclocking. You mention expansion slots, but are you actually going to be using these? I would think 2 PCI-e x4 would be enough if by chance you have to put something in there. This still has USB 3.0 and Sata III.

Not getting that mobo leads to you getting a better card. If you are planning on going the 1920x1080 monitor upgrade you are better off with a 7850 instead of a GTX 560 SE. Even if you want to stick with Nvidia at least you are now able to get a GTX 560 Ti instead.

[Pancake]

Source?

I think we confirmed what we pretty much knew all along: Sandy Bridge's improved memory controller has all but eliminated the need for extreme memory bandwidth, at least for this architecture. It's only when you get down to DDR3-1333 that you see a minor performance penalty. The sweet spot appears to be at DDR3-1600, where you will see a minor performance increase over DDR3-1333 with only a slight increase in cost. The performance increase gained by going up to DDR3-1866 or DDR3-2133 isn't nearly as pronounced.

We also found that memory bandwidth does scale with CPU clock speed; however, it still doesn't translate into any meaningful real-world performance. The sweet spot still appears to be DDR3-1600. All of the extra performance gained by overclocking almost certainly comes from the CPU overclock itself and not from the extra memory bandwidth.

Also These Graphs:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4503/sandy-bridge-memory-scaling-choosing-the-best-ddr3/7


I feel that it is better to invest $5 on this small upgrade than to be bottlenecked later on with overclocking. You get over a 10% boost with read/write/copy speeds and around a 6 FPS boost. Anyways, they look cool. :)

[Goku]

Ram speed is so quick now you are won't notice that day to day regular stuff that we do. Really isn't any kind of performance boost for gaming either. Totally up to the user if its worth the extra $5 imo.

[Rbstr]

I don't particularly like Goku's new motherboard: It only has two memory slots and it doesn't seem to have LucidLogix Virtu, which by lots of accounts is a great performance booster. (It may have it, but I can't seem to confirm)

But in general...I agree with the idea the graphics card is probably the most important thing to get bumped up in spec at this point.

[Vancha]

Also These Graphs:
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4503/sandy-bridge-memory-scaling-choosing-the-best-ddr3/7


I feel that it is better to invest $5 on this small upgrade than to be bottlenecked later on with overclocking. You get over a 10% boost with read/write/copy speeds and around a 6 FPS boost. Anyways, they look cool. :)
http://www.anandtech.com/show/4503/sandy-bridge-memory-scaling-choosing-the-best-ddr3/6

Real life's what matters. Zero difference in gaming.

Having said that, I'm wondering if bumping the RAM up to 16GB won't make UDK/Unity more comfortable? Reading up on game programming and apparently some of those programs can happily eat up 8GB.

[Goku]

I don't like Goku's new motherboard: It only has two memory slots and it doesn't seem to have LucidLogix Virtu, which by lots of accounts is a great performance booster.

But in general...I agree with the idea the graphics card is probably the most important thing to get bumped up in spec at this point.

Ram slots? We have 8GB of ram. By the time that is a issue for him the CPU will be way dated.

Lol. I had no idea LucidLogix Virtu did that with video cards. That is cool and all, but it doesn't look like a great performance booster. Maybe thats why I never really heard much about it even people make a fuss about it. Even with that the 7850 is still a stronger card anyway. Not worth the price premuim.

http://www.anandtech.com/show/4503/sandy-bridge-memory-scaling-choosing-the-best-ddr3/6

Real life's what matters. Zero difference in gaming.

Having said that, I'm wondering if bumping the RAM up to 16GB won't make UDK/Unity more comfortable? Reading up on game programming and apparently some of those programs can happily eat up 8GB.

Thats another $50 right there. Needs the proper mobo. Plus if we are talking about a new video card he will probably have to jump his budget to at least $850 area anyway.

This is the cheapest mobo (http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813138357) that supports 4 dimms. With this mobo actually plus 8GB of the $40 gskill brings this to $804. That isn't too bad. No idea if that mobo supports the lucid or not. Its a 7 series though.

[Mutant]

Having said that, I'm wondering if bumping the RAM up to 16GB won't make UDK/Unity more comfortable? Reading up on game programming and apparently some of those programs can happily eat up 8GB.

I have had to cut down some of my multiphysics simulation models to fit into 32GB.


Its safe to say if you can use more than 8 GB you already know what it will be for.

[Soyokaze]

After playing with it some more, I've upgraded to a GTX480 & i5-2310. I've got that cheap 4xRam slot mobo you mentioned, just in case my development work gets serious. In any case, the upgrade to a quad core should improve performance from within UDK. Also running a 120gb SSD, with plans to add a larger standard HDD later, and a 620watt power supply to feed the hungry card & those possible expansions.

SAMSUNG 22X DVD Burner SATA Model SH-222BB/BEBE - OEM
Antec Gaming Series One Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
EVGA 015-P3-1480-KR GeForce GTX 480 (Fermi) 1536MB 384-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support..
Antec EarthWatts EA-650 GREEN 650W ATX12V v2.3 SLI Ready CrossFire Certified 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active...
Intel Core i5-2310 Sandy Bridge 2.9GHz (3.2GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD...
ADATA S510 Series AS510S3-120GM-O 2.5" 120GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) - OEM
BIOSTAR B75MU3+ LGA 1155 Intel B75 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
Team Vulcan 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model

Currently at $730 including all shipping and such.

Sound good? (Basically just looking for someone who knows more about this than me to tell me I'm now blowing cash.)

[Vancha]

Don't get the 480, it's a loud and power-hungry pig. Get a 560ti 448 core (same price or less with rebates), or an HD 7850 if you can find one for the same price (you probably can't).

[Soyokaze]

I considered the 7850 & 580ti 448, but sound & power consumption aren't a big deal to me - and beyond this why would I pay >$50 more to drop a tier in power? The 480 for $199 seems like an incredible deal to me.

[Vancha]

I considered the 7850 & 580ti 448, but sound & power consumption aren't a big deal to me - and beyond this why would I pay >$50 more to drop a tier in power? The 480 for $199 seems like an incredible deal to me.
You don't drop a tier, they're as good as each other. Granted, I was looking at the wrong prices, but it's only $40 (not >$50). The extra power the 480 uses will probably cost you more than that in the long-run.

[Goku]

After playing with it some more, I've upgraded to a GTX480 & i5-2310. I've got that cheap 4xRam slot mobo you mentioned, just in case my development work gets serious. In any case, the upgrade to a quad core should improve performance from within UDK. Also running a 120gb SSD, with plans to add a larger standard HDD later, and a 620watt power supply to feed the hungry card & those possible expansions.

SAMSUNG 22X DVD Burner SATA Model SH-222BB/BEBE - OEM
Antec Gaming Series One Black Steel ATX Mid Tower Computer Case
EVGA 015-P3-1480-KR GeForce GTX 480 (Fermi) 1536MB 384-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 2.0 x16 HDCP Ready SLI Support..
Antec EarthWatts EA-650 GREEN 650W ATX12V v2.3 SLI Ready CrossFire Certified 80 PLUS BRONZE Certified Active...
Intel Core i5-2310 Sandy Bridge 2.9GHz (3.2GHz Turbo Boost) LGA 1155 95W Quad-Core Desktop Processor Intel HD...
ADATA S510 Series AS510S3-120GM-O 2.5" 120GB SATA III MLC Internal Solid State Drive (SSD) - OEM
BIOSTAR B75MU3+ LGA 1155 Intel B75 HDMI SATA 6Gb/s USB 3.0 Micro ATX Intel Motherboard
Team Vulcan 8GB (2 x 4GB) 240-Pin DDR3 SDRAM DDR3 1600 (PC3 12800) Desktop Memory Model

Currently at $730 including all shipping and such.

Sound good? (Basically just looking for someone who knows more about this than me to tell me I'm now blowing cash.)

1. No OS included in that.
2. No HDD. No way you are going to get by with a 120GB SSD. Even if you think its possible its not. Go HDD then SSD later on if you are crash limited atm.
3. With OS+HDD that brings you to $900 for this build.

Do you realize this?

I don't recommend getting that SSD either. You should be looking at the Crucial M4, Samsung 830, Plextor M3, or Intel SSD. Its wortht the extra $20 to $40 easily to the due better reliability.

[Pancake]

Don't get the 480, it's a loud and power-hungry pig. Get a 560ti 448 core (same price or less with rebates), or an HD 7850 if you can find one for the same price (you probably can't).

Don't get the 560 Ti 448! The 570 is the exact same price but you get 480 cores instead. The 560 Ti 448 is a 570 with disabled cores btw.

570: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100007709&IsNodeId=1&Description=570&bop=And&Order=PRICE&PageSize=20
560 Ti 448: http://www.newegg.com/Product/ProductList.aspx?Submit=ENE&N=100006519%2040000048%204018&IsNodeId=1&Description=448&name=%24200%20-%20%24300&Order=PRICE&Pagesize=20

[LatinLegacy]

Newegg is a well known site but I often tell my clients to check out multiple sites as Newegg doesn't always have the best deals going...

http://www.microcenter.com
http://www.tigerdirect.com
http://www.mwave.com
http://www.zipzoomfly.com - Recently Died :(
http://www.amazon.com

Their are some other sites as well but they are not as popular as the ones mentioned above.

Secondly, look for bundles! Bundles will usually save you anywhere from $10 to a few hundred dollars depending on your purchase. For example, you can bundle a CPU & PSU & save $15. Then bundle a GPU & Motherboard to save an additional $20. Newegg & Tigerdirect are well known for their bundle deals so you should see how much further you can save by bundling parts. Microcenter often does some wicked bundle sales as well. With the extra money you'll be saving, you can put it towards a slightly higher clocked CPU, a better PSU, etc. Also stay on the lookout for instant rebates & mail in rebates. You can pocket some more money that way as well.

One last note, the July 4th holiday is just around the corner & it is a major holiday for hardware sales. Tigerdirect is usually very aggressive with sales at the mid to low range. Since your budget falls within that, you may end up finding some better deals. I would wait until then to see if you can part out a better system at the similar price range that you are working with. Hope the information helps.

-LatinLegacy

[Bags]

^ but he lives nowhere near microcenter

[Soyokaze]

Found Windows cheaper here:http://www.softwaresupplygroup.com/microsoft-windows-7-home-premium-64-bit-oem-branded.html

But otherwise looks like I'll go with Goku's build (surprise surprise)

Except the GPU is now out of stock: SAPPHIRERadeon HD 7850 OC 2GB 256-bit GDDR5 PCI Express 3.0 x16 HDCP Ready CrossFireX Support Video Card ( 11200-01-20G )

Would this http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16814150608 be the same thing?

[Goku]

Hmm nice find.

Are you going with the B75 chipset and 16GB of ram?

That 7850 is the same yes. The reviews aren't the best, which is why I didn't link it. If you want to try it go for it.

Are you ordering this soon? There is some active coupons going that can be applied to that build. I didn't factor them in, since I didn't know how long you were going to wait.

[Soyokaze]

Yeah. I found the coupons. I got the whole bundle for $737.13, tax, shipping, & all - before rebates.

Thanks for the help guys and sorry for the lack of erudition.

[Goku]

Glad it worked out.