Originally Posted by Malorn
Everything you do contributes to others' perceptions of you. The way you dress is a huge part of it. It's unavoidable. People form opinions based on how you look and how you behave. Some looks & behaviors are red flags in peoples' minds. Signal enough of them and you might get unwanted attention.
You think you're going to have the same chance at getting a job as a bank teller with a bunch of facial tattoos and dressed like a bum as the clean-cut & clean-skinned guy in a suit? Don't be ridiculous - the way you dress and the way you look & behave tells others important information about you and they use that information. You may not think that it should matter, but that's reality. You can complain about it or you can evolve and use it to your advantage.
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There's a long, deep gulf between not getting a job, and ending up shot dead, because of how you dress.
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This is not always clean cut. Someone who got mugged walking through a bad part of town could always be criticized of not being street-smart and putting themselves at risk. That goes for other things too.
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This did not happen in a 'bad part of town'. If we're profiling people based on clothing, it could happen anywhere (and did, in this case), and that's not a society I want to live in. Do you? Does anyone?
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There's a reason some Muslim communities want women clothed head-to-toe, and it's because they don't want them tempting the men by putting bad throughts into their head. When women flaunt their goods they put ideas into heads and instill lust and desire. The Muslim method addresses this with a "out of sight, out of mind" philosophy to reduce the danger. I'm not advocating that lifestyle and I'm not saying that means women are entirely responsible for what happens to them, but I think it would be silly to say their choices always have no effect on the outcome. Sometimes they do, directly or indirectly, whether it was a decision to take a shortcut through an alley or to show off the goods. Many women do the latter to get attention, but it isn't always the good kind of attention.
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You are dancing on the very edge of misogyny here. We are talking about people here; real people, and not products to be browsed, or "goods" to be purchased or inspected for quality. (Note my bold highlight above). The subjugation of women in strict muslim cultures is a point of shame for the species as a whole and morally outrageous. Anybody who understands even remotely the injustices committed to women in countries such as these (and indeed, in some ways, in places closer to home) should find that mode of thinking repulsive in the extreme, and indefensible.
Men are responsible for their own behavior. Full stop. If you believe otherwise, you are
wrong and need to take some time to do some soul-searching and contemplate why it is you think it's okay to blame females for the actions of males who, by every measure we have available to us, are in full control of their faculties. External mind control is not yet a reality.
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That doesn't stop other people from forming opinions about you based on the decisions you freely make. That's their right in a free society. It's also their right to protect themselves and their property, so if you behave as though you might be harming one of those or have intent to harm then you may well get confronted about it. If you're poking around cars (which by itself is not a crime, but is suspicious in that it indicates you might be casing targets), or behaving erratically (which is not a crime, but is suspicious in that it may indicate you are unstable or may be a danger to others or yourself). Good citizens are well within their rights to take notice of that and do something/say something about it. Just as you can do what you want so can they.
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People can have whatever opinions they want. And if they feel they are within their rights to call the police on me because they are racist, or because they are in their 60s and think that a kid with baggy jeans is obviously selling crack, or whatever reason they feel; that's why we have the police. That's why we pay taxes to fund them. I might find it insulting, or an inconvenience, but
that's their right. If they do it too much, or for frivolous or petty reasons, we have laws in place to deal with that. The police are an invaluable resource and I have no problem with their utilization.
In this case, a private, untrained, joe-shmoe citizen took it upon himself to go be Batman, and as a result an unarmed teenager ended up dead on the ground. If innocent people are being killed, then the system of thinking that led to those events was broken and needs fixing. It's broken in all of us, or anyone who thinks what Zimmerman did was anything other than manslaughter.
I don't care if Trayvon was wearing a hoodie that said "kill whitey" and was slinking around with shifty eyes, rubbing his hands like Snidely Whiplash. He didn't break into anything, or commit any crimes that are in evidence. Zimmerman called the police, but then
took matters into his own hands after being
explicitly told not to and now someone is dead.
Not a society I have any interest in living in. That is why I am so categorically against that kind of thinking, Malorn. Because in that world, innocent people who might otherwise be alive today end up dead.