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Old 2012-04-26, 10:14 PM   [Ignore Me] #16
Stardouser
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Sobekeus View Post
That is exactly what I'm suggesting. It makes as much sense as field artillery existing does in a war that would have space ships that can vaporize entire bases...
Except we aren't getting those space ships?
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Old 2012-04-26, 10:58 PM   [Ignore Me] #17
Raka Maru
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I'm liking this idea.

Park your arty.
Get out and laze.
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Old 2012-04-27, 12:45 AM   [Ignore Me] #18
Baneblade
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Stardouser View Post
Except we aren't getting those space ships?
It doesn't matter if we get them or not, this is a sci fi wargame.

So if we must have Field Artillery, don't let Fritts get free kills from not even playing.
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Old 2012-04-27, 12:47 AM   [Ignore Me] #19
Toppopia
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


I think artillery is a cool idea but having it automatically attack what you laze is a bit pointless, maybe if it was like a vehicle where someone had to control it and someone designated targets for you, then that could open up a new cert tree for artillery users and add a new realm of gameplay, get 2-3 artillery batteries shelling a base right before a big attack.
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Old 2012-04-27, 12:50 AM   [Ignore Me] #20
Baneblade
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Toppopia View Post
I think artillery is a cool idea but having it automatically attack what you laze is a bit pointless, maybe if it was like a vehicle where someone had to control it and someone designated targets for you, then that could open up a new cert tree for artillery users and add a new realm of gameplay, get 2-3 artillery batteries shelling a base right before a big attack.
You never played PlanetSide did you.
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Old 2012-04-27, 12:53 AM   [Ignore Me] #21
Toppopia
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


No, but i think from what i have read it was a tank that you had to have LOS of something to shoot at stuff
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Old 2012-04-27, 01:28 AM   [Ignore Me] #22
Stardouser
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Sobekeus View Post
It doesn't matter if we get them or not, this is a sci fi wargame.

So if we must have Field Artillery, don't let Fritts get free kills from not even playing.
It's not free kills. This is a strategic game, they are strategic assets. When you are taking casualties from it, you deploy something to counter it. And you don't use spaceships that can vaporize 20 square miles per shot when you want to capture something, you need things like artillery to deliver more precise and less collateral damage.

People want to sterilize any kill from the game that isn't made face to face with a chance to outshoot your opponent. That is not the way to do things. Flails had 30 meter blast radius, that was the problem. Cut it to 5 and the complaints that are left are people seeking, as I say, to sterilize all but face to face kills. And if we're going to do that, then mines have to go, those are free kills if artillery is, aircraft has to go, those are often free kills, it never ends.
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Old 2012-04-27, 02:03 AM   [Ignore Me] #23
Talek Krell
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Stardouser View Post
Flails had 30 meter blast radius, that was the problem. Cut it to 5
I would also reduce the accuracy and have it fire in bursts of a dozen shells or such. Make it an area bombardment/suppresion weapon rather than a fist of god thing. Combined with some of the remote control ideas that would make it work sort of like the artillery calldown in your run of the mill shooter, except it actually exists out there somewhere and can be hunted down by your enemy.
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Old 2012-04-27, 03:05 AM   [Ignore Me] #24
Sirisian
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Talek Krell View Post
I would also reduce the accuracy and have it fire in bursts of a dozen shells or such. Make it an area bombardment/suppresion weapon rather than a fist of god thing. Combined with some of the remote control ideas that would make it work sort of like the artillery calldown in your run of the mill shooter, except it actually exists out there somewhere and can be hunted down by your enemy.
That's the kind of stuff I don't like with artillery and why I said each shell is designed for precision. Spam weapons basically lack skill in my opinon. If I know my artillery vehicle (or my squadmate's artillery vehicle) is deployed 500 m away and it takes like 10 seconds for the shell to travel I'd like to be able to lead a target. Especially if there's multiple artillery pieces the ability to say "Fire here, here, and here" then wait for the reload as you see a tank attempt to dodge them as they hit. You described it perfectly. It's akin to a "rods from god" kinetic weapon. That is you might hit infantry, but they're gonna see the shell in the air with its tail most of the time. Basically just a delayed AV weapon.

That with the ability to shoot it out of the sky with AV (or allow lock-on AA rockets from fighters) you have a balanced piece. Star already mentioned how it opens up fun sabotage gameplay for C4 holding infiltrators.

That and I never mentioned much about sidegrades since this thread is very old. It could have a sidegrade for different barrels and ammo. Faster fire rate with lower accuracy for instance. Would allow people to really fine tune things for how they want to play.
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Old 2012-04-27, 03:31 AM   [Ignore Me] #25
Raka Maru
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"You should be trying to kill me with your rifle" is the mentality from a lot of people, but as Stardouser pointed out, it is sterilizing the game play to run-shoot-hide repeat.

Use some tactics. I spent lots of good PS1 time hunting flails and spotters. Hope to do something similar with PS2 arty.
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Old 2012-04-27, 04:04 AM   [Ignore Me] #26
Talek Krell
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Sirisian View Post
It's akin to a "rods from god" kinetic weapon.
And that is precisely what I wouldn't like to see on the battlefield. Extreme precision high lethality artillery was how we ended up with door and v-pad camping flails, and that wasn't particularly fun for anyone involved.
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Old 2012-04-27, 12:57 PM   [Ignore Me] #27
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Talek Krell View Post
And that is precisely what I wouldn't like to see on the battlefield. Extreme precision high lethality artillery was how we ended up with door and v-pad camping flails, and that wasn't particularly fun for anyone involved.
That's why in the earlier posts it was suggested that for this to work we need the ability for shells to be shot down by AA which limits the effectiveness of the artillery within bases and against galaxies with a gunner. Ideally your run of the mill lightning should be able to see a shell and aim and slam it out of the air with AA or other means.

On a more complex note since I can't find the thread allowing any weapon to damage a shell would also help to mitigate this. Others have mentioned wanting to use lock-on rockets to shoot a shell out of the air which I think is a wonderful idea.
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Old 2012-04-27, 06:59 PM   [Ignore Me] #28
Talek Krell
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Originally Posted by Sirisian View Post
That's why in the earlier posts it was suggested that for this to work we need the ability for shells to be shot down by AA which limits the effectiveness of the artillery within bases and against galaxies with a gunner. Ideally your run of the mill lightning should be able to see a shell and aim and slam it out of the air with AA or other means.
I think I've boiled my concerns down to two things.

1. It seems more annoying than engaging. Manual interception sounds more like a chore than anything. You've got people having to sit in the AA turret just to shoot down occasional fire from cloakers hiding behind rocks half a klick away, and you're essentially bombarding people with "press X to not die" events or just instagibbing them because they weren't looking in the right direction depending on what warning they get. I'm presuming a hit from this thing would be at least near fatal. They don't use the phrase "rods from god" to suggest the gentle caress of our loving savior. Automatic interception on the other hand makes me concerned about mandatory optional modules and whether there would be a chilling effect on field warfare, which I want there to be more of.

2. Aesthetically the idea of an artillery shell that moves slowly enough to be shot down manually just feels weird. That's easy enough though. Just have it be a cruise missile or something. It does also bring up the subject of whether there would be warning, who would get the warning, and how much information would be given.

It's not something I'd be opposed to trying in beta, I just have doubts about the resulting gameplay.
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Old 2012-04-27, 07:03 PM   [Ignore Me] #29
Stardouser
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


It's really not even necessary that the projectiles be able to be shot down. If you're at your own base you will often be in cover since there is no destruction. If it's a battle out in the open, you should be moving.
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Old 2012-04-27, 08:14 PM   [Ignore Me] #30
Pollo Jack
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Re: Squad Remote Artillery Vehicles


Artillery doesn't work in a game like Planet Side.

You never played so we can't expect you to understand.
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