3 Gun Vehicles

capiqu · 2013-10-06, 04:59 PM

How would you guys feel if MBT's , Empire specific buggies, Saunderers and future deliverers Could be loaded with AA, AV and AI guns simultaneously ?
All MBT would have 3 gunners and the ESV would include 3 gunners and a rumble seat. The Saunderers and Delivers would have 4 guns but lower ammo capacity per gun.

Sirisian · 2013-10-06, 06:07 PM

The issue is vehicles with a lot of players in them are expected to be stronger. This makes them much harder to kill and less fun to fight against. That is they tend to farm with say 2 people in them using their armor as an advantage.

Two people per vehicle is the sweet spot. This is the problem with the Liberator at the moment. It's really a 2 person vehicle, but they decided to slam on an extra gun for no real reason. The Harasser for some reasons is the same way. A 2 person vehicle with an extra seat put on for no reason. Then you have the flash back seat which is essentially almost as broken an idea. More of a waste of time if anything to add extra seats like that.

A big part of the game is also large battles. Having 4 people in two tanks looks better in the game than 6 people in two tanks on the battlefield. Creating large battles is easier if all vehicles are limited to two players.

PredatorFour · 2013-10-06, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by Sirisian

Then you have the flash back seat which is essentially almost as broken an idea. More of a waste of time if anything to add extra seats like that.

Not if you have a cloaked flash with full stealth and a medic on the back chucking c4 onto tanks, now that is fun and useful

.

I would love to see more teamwork based vehicles like the old deli variants. Of course they would have to be balanced though and i don't think soe could make this happen.

blampoet · 2013-10-07, 05:02 AM

Originally Posted by Sirisian

- snipp-

strongly disagree

TL;DR- ps2 is a coop game, it has to differentiate itself and FAST (BS4 is around the corner- and it's probably better in the one-on-one twitch reflexes shooter squad based thing).
Vehicles with more people= more difficult to do effectively =should be more rewarding

The issue is vehicles with a lot of players in them are expected to be stronger. This makes them much harder to kill and less fun to fight against.

again, something that cooperation between players can mitigate (come watch my outfit do bait and switch with tankmines against NC tanks on miller)

That is they tend to farm with say 2 people in them using their armor as an advantage.

this works for exactly a handful of seconds against an organized squad (ODST an engi/LA with 1 packet of C4 and everything with wheels dies) that ends the harvest before it even begins

Two people per vehicle is the sweet spot. This is the problem with the Liberator at the moment. It's really a 2 person vehicle, but they decided to slam on an extra gun for no real reason.

The reason for the rear gunner on the libi is for AA support- which it badly needs or (and i'm still not at that level) for more effective bombing runs (empty the front gun & a round or two from the belly gun & wrap it up with the 3-4 bulldog grenades as you climb to escape= enough damage to kill ANYTHING). Unfortunate most non-outfit people have a hard time getting 2 effective crew members.

The Harasser for some reasons is the same way. A 2 person vehicle with an extra seat put on for no reason. Then you have the flash back seat which is essentially almost as broken an idea. More of a waste of time if anything to add extra seats like that.

same mistake, a pocket engi is very effective. the NC rocket launcher is also an excellent piece to have on the back of a harrr-ass-errr. same problem as the libi though, difficult to find people worth snot.

A big part of the game is also large battles. Having 4 people in two tanks looks better in the game than 6 people in two tanks on the battlefield. Creating large battles is easier if all vehicles are limited to two players.

i'm not so much concern about the looks. More vehicles is also a bad things (1-more difficult to control for the platoon lead 2-more of a mess going through bottle necks 3-system resources are taxed more)
the one advantage of lower crew number wheels is less loss to afk.

I advocate a deeper strategic game-play (see my signature)- I think it's ok for vehicles to be near useless when not fully loaded, this will encourage people to join squads/outfits when they enter the game.

MrMak · 2013-10-07, 07:10 AM

For the tanks you could make them 3 seaters (and buff their armor and main guns acordingley) and give the driver a hull mounted anti infantry weapon as an option (perhaps at the cost of extra front armor or some usefull utility much like the Fuel tanks on the ESFs).

Then you got the Main gun anmd secondary gun. If you REALY want to make multi crewed tanks scary add a coax to the main gun. Their numbers could be managed by both the tech plant bonus and the new resource system (when they finaly get around to it) making them much more expensive than they are now.

As a specialised counter and to partialy apese the "i want to drive a big tank alone" crowd throw in single seat Tank destroyers like the ones in this thread http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...ad.php?t=56004

Those would be a cheaper to mass option with comparable firepower but would be forced to specialise and vunerable to flanking.

As for anything other than tanks beign able to have a "universal" weapon loadout id sa i dont see anythign in the current roster that would need that. Sunderers arent supose to fight other vehicles (though they are suprisingly nasty with 2 basilisks) and they cna already arm themselves with a jack of all trades gun (again basilisk) or mount an anti infantry and AA gun. Libs jsut need something to make the tailguner position more atractive. Berhaps put it on a rail that lets it meve to swithch between its current position and one where it has a betterview on whats below (with its field of fie partialy converging with the main gun).

Or simply moun 2 guns on the back (one aimed at the gorund one aimed where it curently is) and let the tail gunner switch between them. Hell remote controling multiple guns by one person was posssible during World War II.

Would aslo add more customisability to the liberator. You could mout 1 anti gorund and one AA gun on the back or you could mout 2 AA guns to give the tailgunenr a wider field of fire.

Making the guns a tad more usefull would also help.

maradine · 2013-10-07, 01:42 PM

I would absolutely love a 3-seat MBT. Getting anyone to agree on an implementation is where things go to shit.

Blynd · 2013-10-07, 02:38 PM

If agree to 3 an mbt if the drive had no gun.

NewSith · 2013-10-07, 08:46 PM

Originally Posted by Sirisian

Then you have the flash back seat which is essentially almost as broken.

Don't offend the Flash. At least not until there's another cheap vehicle that offers a quick transportation method for two people.

The rumble seat significantly changed the way 2-player infantry groups play the game, that's based on our periodic coop play with my friend as it added something two players can do OTHER than to zerg and to drive MBTs/Liberators. We can now actually try and go for backcaps without wasting 750 resources both just to get to a base.

bpostal · 2013-10-07, 08:49 PM

Originally Posted by Blynd

If agree to 3 an mbt if the drive had no gun.

A proper driver/gunner/gunner Prowler would be nice to have.

Taramafor · 2013-10-07, 09:49 PM

Originally Posted by maradine

I would absolutely love a 3-seat MBT. Getting anyone to agree on an implementation is where things go to shit.

I imagine balance is where it goes to shit. How would you balance out a MBT that already has shields AND three guns/a spot for an engineer to repair or a max to shoot?

Timealude · 2013-10-07, 10:19 PM

Originally Posted by Taramafor

I imagine balance is where it goes to shit. How would you balance out a MBT that already has shields AND three guns/a spot for an engineer to repair or a max to shoot?

Make the slot that is used for the shield be taken up by a cert so you could equip a third gun instead of the shield?

MrMak · 2013-10-08, 07:37 AM

Originally Posted by Timealude

Make the slot that is used for the shield be taken up by a cert so you could equip a third gun instead of the shield?

or simply make it so that the hull mounted gun disables the utility solot alltogether.

Then its a tough choice.

MrMak · 2013-10-08, 07:39 AM

Originally Posted by Timealude

Make the slot that is used for the shield be taken up by a cert so you could equip a third gun instead of the shield?

or simply make it so that the hull mounted gun disables the utility solot alltogether.

Then its a tough choice. MOAR DAKKA or utilities. 9think we all know what TR would choose)