Making a deeper, more persistent metagame

[OutlawDr]

This is a discussion about making a deeper, more persistent metagame.
Required reading:
http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...t=39563&page=8

We often hear that PS2's maps and world will be persistent. While this is true, PS1 vets know this is really only half the truth. How you leave the map for the night is not how its going to look the next day. All the gains you and your outfit made the night prior could be completely altered by the handful of people playing in the early morning and afternoon before prime time. Thats the nature of Planetside, and it is what it is. Not much you can do about that directly.

However it can leave you deflated after awhile. I played PS1 for about a year and half, but left once I felt I was just doing the same thing over and over with no direction. There were no persistent, over reaching goals to shoot for that go beyond the night. In other words the metagame was shallow. Outfits can help with this, but only for so long. I'm amazed by people that stayed with PS1 for so many years. However, I get told the same by people when I tell them I played PS1 for over a year.

The good news is I think creating a deeper metagame won't be that hard, and would require simple enough additions that won't affect the gameplay at all (for those who are perfectly content with the way things are). The simple solution: keep score. Keep score of each empires holdings per server. Nothing gets people more fired up to play than good ole competition with bragging rights on the line. I'm NOT talking about matches, events or resets. Simply an official and robust system that keeps tabs on whats going on. Something that players can look at and see clearly whats going on. Nothing will pull players away from the main fight. Everyone is playing the same game. Its still going to be the same never ending war we all want. And at the same time nothing forces players to care about "the score", and they are free to ignore it and play as normal. For those that do care, it would give them that appreciated extra incentive to continue playing for the long haul. Its something that both casual players and competitive outfits can participate in and enjoy.

For example, at the end of each hour the game tallies the number of resources nodes an empire holds in their server across the continents and then assigns points for them. More important bases can go for more points. Those points are then tallied for the daily score. Daily scores can be tallied for the weekly, monthly and yearly...you get the idea. The reward for "winning" for that day, week, month ect..can be nothing more than bragging rights for that empire on the server. Honestly this enough for most people...its good enough for the endless amounts of non-professional gaming leagues. The one caveat I would add here is that the game only keeps score for hours during peek prime time (usually between 7pm-11pm). The main reason for this is to dissuade any farming and gaming of the system during off hours. Its easy for a groups of players to plan 4am base farm session with the use of cross faction alts. Server mods can combat this, but it will be an never ending battle which will leave suspicion and questions on the legitimacy of the scores. Limiting scoring to just prime time will side step all that. Plus this is when it will matter the most anyway, as most players will be on during that time and competition will be at its fiercest. EDIT:I've altered this part based on feedback. Points scored per hour are modified by current population compared to that empires peek population on server and by server faction population imbalances. If an empire is at 50% of peek population it translates to 50% of points scored per hour. At the same time empires with lower populations compared to the other empires score higher than normal and vice versa.

In the end, it really changes nothing on how the game is played, and it really is just a glorified and spruced up stat tracking system. But I think something simple like this can go a long way in making the metagame more meaningful, and help make players care a bit more about the daily happenings of the never ending war.

[Barbapapa123]

I hope they keep the old badges from ps1

[johnflenaly]

So people who can't play during primetime don't count?

[Resolve]

I agree. We could use percentages of time holding the continent per week or something. I'm sure we'll see "who's winning" stats and stuff.

[OutlawDr]

Originally Posted by johnflenaly

So people who can't play during primetime don't count?

They wouldn't count for scoring purposes, but how they leave the map for the next group will obviously have an impact. But I'd suggest playing in a server with a prime time during your main play times.

[Bazilx]

I'm probably one of the only people who would actually like resets a lá Guildwars 2 where each week/2 weeks there is a winner and the bases reset.

[johnflenaly]

Originally Posted by OutlawDr

They wouldn't count for scoring purposes, but how they leave the map for the next group will obviously have an impact. But I'd suggest playing in a server with a prime time during your main play times.

Maybe I don't want a horrible ping! That being said so what if people play in the off time, If they have the time there actions should mean something. Just because you don't have the time doesn't mean others wont, and punishing them by not letting there action contribute to the "meta game" is selfish. If somebody spends 16 straight hours playing, but only 4 hours out of that block actually "mean" something to the overall game, your degrading there gaming experience so your 4 hour effort means more. I'ts a 24 hour game, it should be a 24 hour game. Not a 4 hour game, with 20 hours of "practice".

[OutlawDr]

Originally Posted by johnflenaly

Maybe I don't want a horrible ping! That being said so what if people play in the off time, If they have the time there actions should mean something. Just because you don't have the time doesn't mean others wont, and punishing them by not letting there action contribute to the "meta game" is selfish. If somebody spends 16 straight hours playing, but only 4 hours out of that block actually "mean" something to the overall game, your degrading there gaming experience so your 4 hour effort means more. I'ts a 24 hour game, it should be a 24 hour games. Not a 4 hour game, with 20 hours of "practice".

As at it stands now, the game will only be "24 hours of practice". If you can come up with a solution for the off hour farming and gaming problem, then I could change my mind about it. Imo its a deal breaker. Come up with a solution, or be the selfless person and take one for the team. Like I said, actions in off hours will effect how the map down the road. Its something.

[johnflenaly]

I don't see a problem, if they can get everyone up at 4 in the morning and move the map, there actions should be rewarded by taking territory. Play time is play time, it should effect the game. People with more time are going to have more effect.

[OutlawDr]

Originally Posted by johnflenaly

I don't see a problem, if they can get everyone up at 4 in the morning and move the map, there actions should be rewarded by taking territory. Play time is play time, it should effect the game. People with more time are going to have more effect.

Nah, that is a problem. If you allow this to count then you dilute the importance of the whole thing. It then becomes a competition on which faction can get up the most during off hours to farm when less people are around. I'd rather have 4 hours or rich, meaningful metagame over 0 hours of it.

[johnflenaly]

Originally Posted by OutlawDr

Nah, that is a problem. If you allow this to count then you dilute the importance of the whole thing. It then becomes a competition on which faction can get up the most during off hours to farm when less people are around. I'd rather have 4 hours or rich, meaningful metagame over 0 hours of it.

Dilute the importance of the whole thing? Your entire argument is that only "prime time" should count. Your idea dilutes the importance of 5/6ths of the game. If the go through the effort they should reap the reward period. This is balanced by the fact that the other empires can also get on and play anytime during the 24 hour period. If we go with your idea you might as well shut the game off at 11pm and restart it everyday at 7pm.

[OutlawDr]

Originally Posted by johnflenaly

Dilute the importance of the whole thing? Your entire argument is that only "prime time" should count. Your idea dilutes the importance of 4/5ths of the game. If the go through the effort they should reap the reward period. This is balanced by the fact that the other empires can also get on and play anytime during the 24 hour period. If we go with your idea you might as well shut the game off at 11pm and restart it everyday at 7pm.

Heh, right now nothing "counts". They haven't announced any metagame like this for PS2. So should SOE just shutdown development? 4 hours is better than nothing imo. Lets just agree to disagree on this point, cause it doesn't look like either of us are budging.

[Sifer2]

Easy feature to add but also I don't think it would add that much to the game. Maybe it's just me but i'm not a stat's whore. In fact I usually prefer there to be less stats tracking since then I don't have crap like K/D ratio hanging over me, and influencing how I play the game. Plus this version basically says people that would rather not play the game during peak hours don't count.

I think what they have done with the resource system is far more compelling. Since you can bank resources used to spawn vehicles, and special weapon attachments from taking over an holding these facilities. That is a step in the right direction if you ask me. It's a cautious baby step but it shows they kind of understand that the game is going to keep people hooked for longer if there is long term consequence to taking or losing territory.

Eventually I hope to see them expand on that with things like the Outfit bases. Or Titan mode we discussed in other threads tied into resources. There is actually lots more they could do with this resource system really. The stuff they have now is good on the individual player level. But I would like to see more use for resources for the Empire as a whole. Like if they acquire enough Auraxium as an Empire total they spawn Artillery emplacements. Or a new facility. Some of that stuff might actually be permanent additions to the game too. Similar to world events in other MMO's had where if everyone turned in enough materials they unlocked a new dungeon or something. Only this would be competitive.

[Malachi]

Originally Posted by Bazilx

I'm probably one of the only people who would actually like resets a lá Guildwars 2 where each week/2 weeks there is a winner and the bases reset.

You're not the only one. Having a "winnable" situation is one of the most fundamental components of any game.

I'm not saying I know the best way to implement it in a game like PS, but there should absolutely be long term goals that acquaintances, friends, outfits, and whole servers can work towards and win or fail to achieve. Some should last a weekend, some a week, some a month. Maps should be rotated, introduced, changed up. Score should be kept - personal statistics/contributions, as well as outfit and server accomplishments.

Variety is the spice of life, so I'm not sure why anyone thinks we'd want to take part in the same pointless fight month after month. Don't get me wrong, I'm very much looking forward to the game, but fun gameplay is not the whole equation. And it can only be enhanced by a good bigger-picture game, just as it can only be harmed by one that is poorly done.

[megamold]

in ps1 there were actually outfits they specialized in the "downtime" war.
since they were people either from a differents part of the world or people that work the night shift.

they did lots of spec-ops types stuff with smaller groups, ofcourse the other factions had similar outfits