soft and hv ammo - Page 2

SeraphC · 2013-01-31, 08:12 AM

Originally Posted by Bocheezu

What do you consider a normal engagement range? Because 20m is pretty far in a lot of indoor battles. SPA is fine for indoors only; everybody should have a different loadout for when they go outdoors.

Look at the graph. 2 Extra damage per shot is not going to reduce your TTK. You'll still need the same amount of shots.

If that graph is correct then neither are worth the upgrade cost at all. Just don't get them, spend certs elsewhere.

Mutant · 2013-01-31, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by SeraphC

Look at the graph. 2 Extra damage per shot is not going to reduce your TTK. You'll still need the same amount of shots.

If that graph is correct then neither are worth the upgrade cost at all. Just don't get them, spend certs elsewhere.

At 50+ m I find the added bullet velocity from HV is noticeable and feel its worth more than the added damage, and if you can control the recoil there is no down side, (just a small opportunity cost if SP is an option of <3 damage in the 10-21m range)

The graph is correct based on the working as intended rules, but it does seem from OP that a lot of weapons may not be working as intended.
Shield and heath have 10 bars each with a total of 500 hit points each, each bar is therefore 50 hp, most guns have < 50 damage difference between ammo types. (is there some damage modifier for body shots?)
I think 3 shot data may help pick out some differences.

Stellarthief · 2013-01-31, 08:43 AM

There is a post on the official forums "cheat sheet for infantry weapons, no pistols no max".

I checked this thread when choosing my weapons. Not sure if it's out of date or not.

I think it was the VX6-7 (weapon I use right now most) that gets min damage range extended to 34m with SPA on. I think that's pretty signifant as 34m is quite a distance for a carbine that is designed for CQC or short range combat.
Personally, I've noticed a difference in kills since I started with SPA, while noticing no downside. The rifle still tears it up in CQC and not noticing at short range any downside to bullet velocity. I also dont spray and pray with the carbine, accuracy with short burst fire has stayed the same.

Mutant · 2013-01-31, 08:47 AM

The data is here;

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...pe=view&gid=12

Stellarthief · 2013-01-31, 09:03 AM

I must be blind. don't see anything about data with the ammos.

can you help me out there?

Dodgy Commando · 2013-01-31, 09:26 AM

It would also be interesting to know whether High Velocity rounds actually increase the velocity of the round as their name suggests, or if they just increase the range before damage falloff at long range. That could be a nice addition as targets won't require as much leading.

Mutant · 2013-01-31, 09:43 AM

Originally Posted by Stellarthief

I must be blind. don't see anything about data with the ammos.

can you help me out there?

That page had max and min damage and the rules for ammo are here;

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/...r=false&gid=13

but the "rules" are not confirmed

Stellarthief · 2013-01-31, 09:53 AM

Thanks.

The post on the forums has different values. For example: Carbines

http://i.imgur.com/Xfqrs.png

VX6-7 with SPA range is increased to 33.5m.

IIRC he took values from game data. But I dont know if thats outdated or if he was wrong, etc. I didn't really follow the thread in great detail.

Bocheezu · 2013-01-31, 09:56 AM

Originally Posted by SeraphC

You'll still need the same amount of shots.

At 15-33m, yes. Between 10-15m it will take one less shot to kill a non-infil non-nanoweave because it keeps the 143 damage (7-shot kill) out to 15m while the normal ammo has dropped off and requires 8 shots. SPA will take one more shot beyond 33m.

This doesn't include the effect of grenade/AoE type damage that is much more analog. A guy 0.1m further from a grenade blast may take 2 points less damage than a dude that's closer; I don't know if the game calculates it that way or just rounds to the nearest health/shield bar.

It's a small and very minor upgrade, no doubt, but it doesn't do "nothing."

Mutant · 2013-01-31, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by Stellarthief

Thanks.

The post on the forums has different values. For example: Carbines

http://i.imgur.com/Xfqrs.png

VX6-7 with SPA range is increased to 33.5m.

IIRC he took values from game data. But I dont know if thats outdated or if he was wrong, etc. I didn't really follow the thread in great detail.

The numbers looks the same to me.

That 33.5m is the distance where up to it SP has greater damage (vs default)

edit: here is graph for VX6-7

MyOdessa · 2013-01-31, 10:57 AM

I bought SPA for LC2 Lynx with NV scope and laser. I had problem killing with Lynx/SPA combo, I could not understand, why anyone thought Lynx is a good gun. After I removed SPA, no problem killing at all, Lynx works as intended. I wish could get back 100 certs I spend on this ammo.

Scan · 2013-01-31, 11:28 AM

Just throwing this out there, but HVA would suggest the bullet travels faster, at the expense of the weapon kicking harder.

In addition to doing slightly more damage at longer ranges, wouldn't this mean that you'd have more recoil to pull down, but have having to lead a target less?

Even if it's only a fraction, your bullets arriving at the target faster than his bullets hit you, seems like a pretty big deal.

Lepalose · 2013-01-31, 12:32 PM

Well clearly the HVA seems to have the best benefit compared to SPA, in my opinion.

That said, while HVA does travel faster and require less target leading it comes at the expense of recoil.

So at that point, its your personal feeling whether the recoil negatively effects you.

@MyOdessa - that was my experience with the TRV as well with SPA.

Stellarthief · 2013-02-01, 07:15 AM

Originally Posted by Mutant

The numbers looks the same to me.

That 33.5m is the distance where up to it SP has greater damage (vs default)

Maybe I misunderstood the post on the forums, but I was under the impression from the post that it was the distance to where SP is still doing min damage (max distance for min damage). Not where SP has greater damage than default ammo.

Mutant · 2013-02-01, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Stellarthief

Maybe I misunderstood the post on the forums, but I was under the impression from the post that it was the distance to where SP is still doing min damage (max distance for min damage). Not where SP has greater damage than default ammo.

∩ symbol is for "intersect" so I take it to mean where SP and normal damage intersect. And doing this gives the correct answer for all of the examples i looked at.