El Jacko Hammero

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Alphex

My thoughts as a relative PS newbie: I initially tried using the JH because I thought having a weapon like that would help me learn the ropes of the game a little. I didn't warp intentionally and I never used the 4-shot. I found that I died very, very often. So often, that I basically gave up on grunt work and considered only using vehicles from now.

Recently I gave the Gauss a try. The difference was incredible; with Gauss and Rexo I racked up kills at least twice as fast as when I was using the Hammer, and I even get a free cert point that way. Overall, I don't think the Hammer is just that great. Fix the obvious exploits (warping and 4-shotting) and the whole thing looks really tame.

And personally, I think the gameplay with MA is also much more interesting: If you kill someone that way, instead of just having out-twitched your enemy you actually feel you used better tactics than them to take them down.

I think that too often, people with rexo only use either MA or HA, but not both. I don't understand this, you've got room for alot of crap in rexo. I personally carry, in my default loadout, a Gauss, Deci, and JH. I use my Gauss everywhere outside, and inside for hallways. I think there is a use for both MA and HA, you just have to find where it works for you. The JH will still be incredibly potent after the quad-shot fix, don't kid yourself. I find it equally rewarding getting kills with any weapon, because I try to use tactics at all times. I'm not a bum-rusher very often. Outsmarting the enemy or using the element of surprise definitely makes a kill more enjoyable.

[Alphex]

Originally Posted by infinite loop

I think that too often, people with rexo only use either MA or HA, but not both.

Once I gain a few more cert points, I might try that; it's not really an option at the moment though. Also, I think I'll first get Engineering.

[SpunkJackel]

Hope no one minds if we keep this going, it is farely interesting and I'm bored stiff here at work...anyway

To Warborn, first of this isn't beta. But one of the poblems with using the rocklet in doors and in your face is that while I may cause dammage to the enmy standing 1 meter away in a narrow halway I will also do dammage to myself and any friendlies near by. Which is not so effective. Also most people now carry plasma nades in their thumper and while plasma nades do alot of damage indoors you are liable to injure more than a few friendlies with the splah. One of they key elements to an indoor close quarters weapon is control.

While the Empire Specific MA does do the job in close quarters it still not really designed to. Like, I don't think you can tell me that if this game was realease wihth just the MA stuff and no HA you would not feel like something is missing.

And dude, you may be tired of having battles decided by who ever has the most HA users but in the same sense I am tired of battles being decided by who ever can get the most Hvy Tanks and Reavers and such into the battle. Does that mean we lose most of the vech's from the game? Hope not...

And you are right, it is posible to remowrk the HA and not remove it, but...I persoannly find the HA pretty good right now, dare I say better than it has ever been. I can say with honestly that the Jack is my least favorite of the three and would not loot one the way it is. It really isn' as super 1337 as people say indoors and up close. It is good, but not superman good.

And to TheNoob. Sure we got rail gun's with our current tech. But last heard the smallest one could only be mounted on a battleship. (Err...I may have stole that from a movies so that coul be the wrongest peice of info ever) But christ if they gave NC a rail gun let them have a rail gun, it really wouldn't bother me too mucc. But the thing is I don't belive the Jack as some super power advantage at close range, at least nothing like it use to. It seems fairly balanced and while it may be better then say my Lasher or MCG in close proximity it is nothing that can't be easily overcome. I NEVER come face2face with a NC Jack user and think " OMFG, I'm dead why even try..." I know I have a dam good chance to kill him.

[TheN00b]

Two things:

a) Jackel, do you know what kinetic energy is?

and b) Sure, I am perfectly aware that my enemies do not scream in terror and roll into a fetal position when they see me come around the corner with my Jackhammer. But I believe that all of the weapons should be pretty much or at least close to equal at various ranges. Would you agree that the Jackhammer, except in very rare cases, almost always has at the very least a 5% percent advantage over the enemy indoors?

[Warborn]

To Warborn, first of this isn't beta. But one of the poblems with using the rocklet in doors and in your face is that while I may cause dammage to the enmy standing 1 meter away in a narrow halway I will also do dammage to myself and any friendlies near by. Which is not so effective. Also most people now carry plasma nades in their thumper and while plasma nades do alot of damage indoors you are liable to injure more than a few friendlies with the splah. One of they key elements to an indoor close quarters weapon is control.

Thanks for clearing up the Beta part. I didn't realize it isn't Beta anymore. As for the Rocklet, I used to use it a lot indoors and I didn't have a problem with it. You get a little FF here and there, but that's no reason to ignore its effectiveness against both infantry and MAXs. Weapon control means controlling the weapon you're using, after all. Not stowing any weapon which may possibly harm friendlies.

While the Empire Specific MA does do the job in close quarters it still not really designed to. Like, I don't think you can tell me that if this game was realease wihth just the MA stuff and no HA you would not feel like something is missing.

I felt everything was fine back when we didn't use HA. Some people used sweepers, some used MA, but both did their job fine.

And dude, you may be tired of having battles decided by who ever has the most HA users but in the same sense I am tired of battles being decided by who ever can get the most Hvy Tanks and Reavers and such into the battle. Does that mean we lose most of the vech's from the game? Hope not...

No, it doesn't, but it does mean vehicles need to be addressed. That's not what this thread is for, however.

And you are right, it is posible to remowrk the HA and not remove it, but...I persoannly find the HA pretty good right now, dare I say better than it has ever been. I can say with honestly that the Jack is my least favorite of the three and would not loot one the way it is. It really isn' as super 1337 as people say indoors and up close. It is good, but not superman good.

It's better than anything else, and that's the whole point.

[SpunkJackel]

Right...tough to keep up...

Ahh..kenetic energy, energy of motion. So the damage is keneic instead of explosive...not sure what difference it makes in a game...I mean its all about the stats any way. I could say one thing is explosive and one is kenetic but the values I punch in at the end is what decideds it...no matter, looks as if I missed your point.

Advantage for Jack is that it does high damage instanly, You shoot and the pellets hit. Sure an advantage but it has downsides and really no longer poses a huge threat. It may have a 5% advantage over any other who does not have HA or a MAX. But that's it. Lasher or MCG user vs Jack User...and everyone knows what they are doing and how each weapons works, the playing field is pretty level.

War..ahh...ok last point there. jack is better then everything else BS. Jack no where near has the cababilities of the lasher to suppress NME's that try to come down a hall. And the MCG has some dcent range and a nice and large clip. So the Jack has it's advantage as well do the other weapons.

[Angel_of_Death]

Exactly, each HA weapon has its advantages over the others. JH has incredible close-range capabilities. Lasher is easily the best for suppressing fire. And the MCG is the best at range, and has a large ammo clip.

People complain about the JH alot is because the majority of fights have been pushed indoors. With most fights indoors, the JH gets to do what it does best.

I loot JH's when I can, only because I like change every once in a while, but if I had the option to pick any three of the HA weapons, I'd take lasher followed by MCG, with JH in 3rd. Maybe it's because I used the Lasher for most of my PS time, or just because I don't like the JH in general.

Ok but I don't understand what's so hard about deleting triple-shot.

[Onizuka-GTO]

Originally Posted by SpunkJackel

...with a NC Jack user and think " OMFG, I'm dead why even try..."

You know I've said that to myself a few times,
Getting killed by Jackhammers repeatedly really really annoys me, I have no rational explaination (If anyone does, please tell me), and what's more bizarre is that don't get worked up the same if i keep dying by MCG or Lasher.

Thing is thought, that trail of thought you said, eventually changes to: "ARRGGGHHH! I'm going to keep trying & trying until I killed at leased one! ONE! Those *�):{L>*^&%$!!!!!1111ONE"

[Angel_of_Death]

If you keep getting raped by JH's and it's really pissin you off, then a change of tactics is in order...get a MAX or something.

[Spee]

Originally Posted by Angel_of_Death

If you keep getting raped by JH's and it's really pissin you off, then a change of tactics is in order...get a MAX or something.

Ahh yes, you should see the JackWhore's flail about in thier complete impotence as a quasar walks into the room and starts zapping them all.


Brings a tear to my eye.

[ChemicalHex]

Originally Posted by Angel_of_Death

get a MAX or something.

Thats the whole point. They shouldn't HAVE to.

[infinite loop]

Originally Posted by Spee

Ahh yes, you should see the JackWhore's flail about in thier complete impotence as a quasar walks into the room and starts zapping them all.


Brings a tear to my eye.

But that's when I pull out my deci and waste you

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by SpunkJackel

War..ahh...ok last point there. jack is better then everything else BS. Jack no where near has the cababilities of the lasher to suppress NME's that try to come down a hall. And the MCG has some dcent range and a nice and large clip. So the Jack has it's advantage as well do the other weapons.

I wasn't referring to the Jackhammer being better than the other HA weapons, and I have no idea what made you think I was trying to say that. I meant that the Jackhammer and, indeed, all HA weapons are better than all non-HA weapons indoors. They make everything else obsolete. That's what the point of my post was.

[Angel_of_Death]

Originally Posted by ChemicalHex

Thats the whole point. They shouldn't HAVE to.

And there shouldn't be this much bitching about one gun. But there is.

Also, he said that he kept getting killed by JH's. Well, some people have more problems with some things than others (I can't play fighting games for my life, but I have good hand-eye cooardination so I'm good at FPS'), so I suggested an easier route for him. I don't tell everyone to switch to MAX if a JH kills them.

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by Angel_of_Death

And there shouldn't be this much bitching about one gun. But there is.

So you think people are voicing their complaints for no good reason? That their gameplay is in fact not made less fun by HA, but that they decide to make noise on the forums about it? That's a pretty peculiar thing to think, and I think your attitude toward issues like this is very counter-productive. Where there is smoke, there is fire. If people were having absolutely no problems with the game, they'd be spending time playing, because they'd have no problems or concerns to post about.