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Old 2012-05-05, 06:48 PM   [Ignore Me] #1
Noivad
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Regan Vs Obama


This was funny then and still funny now. Who knew the Truth could make you laugh?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature...&v=3h8O7V-WxWQ

The logic is very strong - Can you break it?
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Old 2012-05-05, 07:04 PM   [Ignore Me] #2
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Re: Regan Vs Obama


Getting government aid to be able to feed yourself and family =/= everyone being forced to get the same grade.

Broken.

Really that video pretty much failed, no wonder he disabled ratings.
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Old 2012-05-06, 12:53 AM   [Ignore Me] #3
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Re: Regan Vs Obama


Originally Posted by Noivad View Post
The logic is very strong - Can you break it?
It's known as a straw man argument. It's often used when an opponent suggests something to then push their hand and exaggerate their position to an extreme. It's extremely effective at pandering to people quickly, but it can have a backlash if people realize it's being done.

This goes back to a conservative topic of taking grayscale problems and turning them into black and white problems with two extremes. So if someone suggested, say reordering taxes to preserve a progressive tax system, it's easy to get people that are unfamiliar with economics to believe that regressive tax codes are fair.

The example in the video is extremely solid. It's been shown time and time again that human greed corrupts pure socialized systems. The gray area that exists between capitalist and socialized system is extremely large, relatively speaking. So large that you can easily exist somewhere in the middle and get the benefits of both. When conservatives force into their followers minds that there are only two choices and that a progressive tax code can't exist within capitalism they lock into one extreme of the argument. Progressive tax systems can't exist within a pure capitalist society. Neither can socialized police, firefighters, socialized medicine, or any safety net outside of private insurance.

Luckily for us, a lot of the more open minded people have realized this broad spectrum between capitalism and socialism allows flexibility where those that have nothing aren't destitute without choices and can grow. Sadly within this is a need for intellectualism that can question and understand why systems we have in place work. Why successful countries, even the United States, sit between pure capitalism and pure socialism. Until people have time to delve into those questions and fully understand them they are easily manipulated by preying on their baser needs with pretexts that falsely trick them into believing they are losing something.

Hopefully this makes it clear that taking Obama's current direction toward preserving the progressive tax system is just that. What the video suggests is that Obama is attempting a pure socialist strategy. He is not. I would recommend anyone here that watches that video to understand the Socialist Grade Averaging experiment and reward models. If you do then you'll understand the problem in a much deeper way than you initially viewed it. It's often used in universities to elicit discussion, but it's sadly used outside of critical thinking areas to make a quick one-off point. Not really it's purpose to be viewed so simply.
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Old 2012-05-06, 01:22 AM   [Ignore Me] #4
Warborn
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Re: Regan Vs Obama


At this point you people should be praying to Aryan, gun-toting Jesus that Obama actually is a socialist who wants to redistribute the wealth. Your system is so fucked that it's going to take something drastic to prevent the middle class from evaporating and the country turning into a Randian hellscape where selfishness and greed are seen as the highest of virtues and people die in the streets for want of basic necessities because "fuck you, got mine" has become the new national motto.

Reagan was a senile, incompetent, treasonous piece of shit. The glorification of that shitbag is laughable.

Last edited by Warborn; 2012-05-06 at 01:25 AM.
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This is the last VIP post in this thread.   Old 2012-05-06, 01:36 AM   [Ignore Me] #5
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Re: Regan Vs Obama


Meh.
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Last edited by Malorn; 2012-09-11 at 03:58 AM.
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Old 2012-05-06, 05:15 AM   [Ignore Me] #6
Figment
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Re: Regan Vs Obama


Originally Posted by Malorn View Post
The straw man is the most common argument; and it's simply sad how effective it is.
Luckily you never apply strawmen; like how you are above calling everyone a socialist.

Last edited by Figment; 2012-05-06 at 05:16 AM.
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Old 2012-05-07, 11:59 AM   [Ignore Me] #7
XLynxX
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Re: Regan Vs Obama





That was simply retarded. The argument had many, many holes in it, and the idea of a school test and comparing it to the economy just shows how little the creater knows about the economy.
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Old 2012-05-07, 06:43 PM   [Ignore Me] #8
Goku
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Re: Regan Vs Obama


Stupidest example possible.
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