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Old 2014-06-28, 12:11 PM   [Ignore Me] #31
GTGD
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


The imbalance is real but I don't think it's because of the weapons and vehicles, this time it's the population of the server Emerald. VS has many large and highly skilled outfits, the NC has a few, and the TR has...3 or 4?

With so much disorganization it's not at all fun to fight against coordinated tactics, so you can't really blame them for avoiding the better outfits. And since ones like GOKU are good at popping up all over the place, it makes them discouraged for going anywhere near VS territory.

There is no easy solution, what the TR needs is better players and leadership. That doesn't come from a patch.
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Old 2014-06-28, 12:15 PM   [Ignore Me] #32
Edfishy
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


To avoid taking away the fun and distinction of the factions, I think when they do the new resource revamp they should consider having races have different resource costs associated with their weaponry. The NC should be the cheapest, TR inbetween, and Vanu get to keep what makes their faction unique but at a higher cost.

More or less the cost dynamics in Starcraft between the Zerg Terran and Protoss.
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Old 2014-06-28, 12:48 PM   [Ignore Me] #33
BlaxicanX
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Have fun justifying to the player base why NC guns are cheaper than Vanu guns or why Terran guns are more expensive, etc.

Every faction thinks their guns are the worst/require the most skill to use effectively.
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Old 2014-06-28, 01:29 PM   [Ignore Me] #34
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by BlaxicanX View Post
Have fun justifying to the player base why NC guns are cheaper than Vanu guns or why Terran guns are more expensive, etc.

Every faction thinks their guns are the worst/require the most skill to use effectively.
If anything, NC guns would at least be tied to have a higher cost than the rest.

TR weapons are basic rifles and can be made in masses, ammo as well being only a number of calibers and being nothing but a case, powder, primer, and bullet. VS needs high tech for their weapons but thanks to a single power source (all weapons use the same battery, just not the same amount of charge used per shot) they can afford to shift a LOT of manpower into making weapons or into their tech. NC on the other hand is FILLED with vastly different weapon types and ammo types Gauss, rifle, converted mining equipment, prototype anything, and likely more with each of them needing their own R&D systems.

It takes a fuckton a work and costs to start making something, ask anyone that works in R&D. But next to nothing once mass production is set in place. And that is what would kill NC weapons if for some reason PS2 gave infantry weapons a cost.
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Old 2014-06-28, 01:38 PM   [Ignore Me] #35
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


If resource costs were directly tied into your side's population, that might help some. Don't increase them, but have them reduced according to the ratio you are disadvantaged.

50% VS pop would mean they pay full price and the other two are likely around half price. This will allow more rapid replacement of vehicles and MAXes and such from the disadvantaged side.
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Old 2014-06-28, 02:19 PM   [Ignore Me] #36
War Barney
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by Baneblade View Post
If resource costs were directly tied into your side's population, that might help some. Don't increase them, but have them reduced according to the ratio you are disadvantaged.

50% VS pop would mean they pay full price and the other two are likely around half price. This will allow more rapid replacement of vehicles and MAXes and such from the disadvantaged side.
Now THAT is a good idea to help solve the zerging problem, 1 side would still have an advantage with numbers but the others could fight back with as you said mass spam of vehicles/MAXs/aircraft, though the cooldown would need to be halved as well or it would most likely not help that much.
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Old 2014-06-28, 03:12 PM   [Ignore Me] #37
Chewy
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by War Barney View Post
Now THAT is a good idea to help solve the zerging problem, 1 side would still have an advantage with numbers but the others could fight back with as you said mass spam of vehicles/MAXs/aircraft, though the cooldown would need to be halved as well or it would most likely not help that much.
Also cont locking would need new perks. Getting half off is to good, far to good even as the game is now, when you can take something in off hours to use for prime time.

More or less doubling a resource is just WTF thinking.
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Old 2014-06-28, 03:25 PM   [Ignore Me] #38
War Barney
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by Chewy View Post
Also cont locking would need new perks. Getting half off is to good, far to good even as the game is now, when you can take something in off hours to use for prime time.

More or less doubling a resource is just WTF thinking.
Aye it is pretty dumb.. getting MAXs for half price, half price MBT so you can spam them easily.... I know they wanted a bonus for locking a cont but the current bonus is WAY to much, its no wonder people are ghost capping them non stop.
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Old 2014-06-28, 03:51 PM   [Ignore Me] #39
Edfishy
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


I think War Barney meant a resource cost reduction in realtime on the continent based on population differences, not as a benefit for locking the continents.
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Old 2014-06-28, 04:51 PM   [Ignore Me] #40
Obstruction
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by War Barney View Post
The words nerfed into oblivion would normally be taken as a complaint that its been nerfed too much. You seem to be back-tracking now and trying to paint me in a bad light because you realise you're wrong.

Thats not very constructive, or polite.
so you didn't pay attention to the liberator nerf? and that the tail and nose are also getting nerfed? also all ammo capacities were reduced 70% and the armor resistances were reverted to pre-update level.

liberator got the same treatment that harasser did. it went from being over buffed to over nerfed. i'm not even sure "nerfed into oblivion" is harsh enough. new players can't even use it anymore, only the few teams that specialized in it before the changes, sinking 25,000+ certs in while it was viable have continued to use it. there are maybe 6 teams per server that still play it, anyone else in a lib is a noob that doesn't know not to try.

i never said what you claimed that i did, and i don't need you to take my words for anything except what is plainly written. that is the point of written language. i'm not backtracking in any way, i explained what i wrote again, since perhaps english is not your native language. you can make all the posts you like that copy my words and try to mock me but i will simply respond seriously and earnestly.
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Old 2014-06-28, 05:02 PM   [Ignore Me] #41
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by War Barney View Post
Now THAT is a good idea to help solve the zerging problem, 1 side would still have an advantage with numbers but the others could fight back with as you said mass spam of vehicles/MAXs/aircraft, though the cooldown would need to be halved as well or it would most likely not help that much.
The cooldown can't be affected. Because it is a cert line and that isn't a can of worms we should open. Besides, anyone seriously going to make a dent with their vehicle spam already has a short enough cooldown on it.
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Old 2014-06-28, 05:04 PM   [Ignore Me] #42
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by Edfishy View Post
I think War Barney meant a resource cost reduction in realtime on the continent based on population differences, not as a benefit for locking the continents.
That was what I brought up, yes. But they are correct about the lock benefit as well.
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Old 2014-06-28, 09:57 PM   [Ignore Me] #43
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by Baneblade View Post
If resource costs were directly tied into your side's population, that might help some. Don't increase them, but have them reduced according to the ratio you are disadvantaged.

50% VS pop would mean they pay full price and the other two are likely around half price. This will allow more rapid replacement of vehicles and MAXes and such from the disadvantaged side.
This. I've seen it suggested before.

More demand=less supply. Over pop faction gets starved easier.

Even if it's just a bandaid till resource revamp.
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Old 2014-06-29, 11:41 AM   [Ignore Me] #44
War Barney
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


If anything this current system of cont locking bonuses will make thing worse than ever, hell it could spell the end of the game. The winning faction now gets a huge strength bonus (double MAX/tanks/air), so while they were winning before they will then go to absolutely destroying with no way to stop them.

I'm forced to ask do they play test or even simply think through ANY of the ideas they push out? or do they just use huge drops in server pop to determine how dumb their ideas are?
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Old 2014-06-30, 01:55 AM   [Ignore Me] #45
Mordelicius
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Re: Update Notes 06/26 Continent Locking and Hossin


Originally Posted by GTGD View Post
The imbalance is real but I don't think it's because of the weapons and vehicles, this time it's the population of the server Emerald. VS has many large and highly skilled outfits, the NC has a few, and the TR has...3 or 4?

With so much disorganization it's not at all fun to fight against coordinated tactics, so you can't really blame them for avoiding the better outfits. And since ones like GOKU are good at popping up all over the place, it makes them discouraged for going anywhere near VS territory.

There is no easy solution, what the TR needs is better players and leadership. That doesn't come from a patch.
This is not the case at all. Skills and organization is not a problem for any Emerald faction. Did you see the Server Smash? That's standard Waterson-style alert. Organized, combined arms and lots of daring last second resecures (It's like most alert there is decided in the last 5 minutes ). The only difference is there are more players on the fight.

Anyway, Vanu trait is high accuracy and suppression fire. In other continents, this trait can be mitigated/countered with skills/organization because it is open spaced and more or less flat lands.

Hossin is a totally different animal. Some Hossin traits that heavily favor Vanu:

- Tiered elevations = increased shooting angles that favors the accurate/long ranged weapons
- Small hiding spots that favored accurate weapons and suppression fire modes.
- Multiple doorways on on large capture point rooms
- Hills, elevation accessible only to the Magrider.
- Limited road pathways and Sundy parking that favor accurate AV weapons.
- Large trees that more or less limit combined arms gameplay.

If you have 5 rocks facing each other. VS will win due to accurate weapon and their suppression fire Lashers and Maxes and pretty much every accurate guns.

I'll give you another example. Hossin capture points normally have an inner balcony. That elevation will favor suppression fire heavy and accurate weapons.

NC Maxes has to defend multiple doors that can be C4ed while VS Maxes can keep their distance. Lashers alone will seal the deal, defensively on those doorways.

Hence, I argue removing the most glaring imbalance as a baseline, focusing on removing the Lasher first and disallowing VS Magriders to climb on normally inaccessible hills. Then move on from there if other changes are necessary.

As it is, Emerald Hossin has VS running NC alt OPS to keep the Hossin equilibrium ( I find that hilarious and stupid at the same time ). Trying to manipulate the situation so problems can't be identified and solved won't solve it, obviously.

And worse, as a result, NC and TR are at each other's throat in that incredibly amazing horizontal North lane (Chac lanes :O), obliterating each other with joyous frenzy, while VS are practically begging people to fight them.

A funny thing happened yesterday which is very telling. A TR hex was cut off and NC was assailing it, resulting in fun last stand scenario for the oppressors. Vanu, nowhere connected with the Hex, came charging with Magriders The first reaction by NC/TR is 'Vanu get out of our fight'.

So, yeah if you want this to continue, ignore the symptoms. I just logged out as VS was about to cap Hossin again. We tried to defend the NC warpgate but with 42% VS Hossin population, it can't be done.

TR and NC was pissed off on the north lanes because VS is ruining their fun. it's funny VS is close to capping and there's still a big fight between the TR/NC at the north horizontal lane.
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