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Old 2012-06-06, 05:26 AM   [Ignore Me] #91
I SandRock
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


VS makes perfect sense they just aren't doing it justice. Like that faction video, TR and NC motivation makes perfect sense. But the VS woman talking just babbles on about vague stuff that makes no sense to anyone. It should be more simple:

Scientists wish to research and delve into alien tech to the fullest extend with no regards to consequences or safety. The TR do not allow any independent faction to exist. And the NC don't deem the scientists' work ethics to be safe. So they wage war on both. Besides that, scientists get so obsessed with this alien species they start worshipping them like gods and perhaps even get 'indoctrinated' by artifacts.

Why do vanu not wipe out TR and NC with superior tech? Because really it's not superior, it's alternative. Plus, scientists with great guns are equal as trained soldiers with normal guns, i guess.


A better argument though would be that NC and TR have no sense for style or fashion so they need to be obliterated so that we can all live in a world where purple sexy suits are prevalent.
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Old 2012-06-09, 02:58 AM   [Ignore Me] #92
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


I all way saw Vanu as the only real "enemy" per say. I agreed with both the TR and NC view points.

Absolute freedom Also means Absolute Chaos.

And

Absolute control, is Absolute slavery.

both have decent view point.

Then there the VS " We invited laser guns! Thus why we are right!"

Seems like a group of nut jobs to me.
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Old 2012-06-09, 03:02 AM   [Ignore Me] #93
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Originally Posted by Vetto View Post
I all way saw Vanu as the only real "enemy" per say. I agreed with both the TR and NC view points.

Absolute freedom Also means Absolute Chaos.

And

Absolute control, is Absolute slavery.

both have decent view point.

Then there the VS " We invited laser guns! Thus why we are right!"

Seems like a group of nut jobs to me.
We also invented the spawntubes you pop out of everytime said laser wepons turn you into a heap of smoking ash on the ground. So don't go judging us as nut jobs... at least we aren't fascists
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Old 2012-06-09, 03:19 AM   [Ignore Me] #94
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


human nature ain't it, i think Cosmical picked up on it perfectly in his cartoon. Vanu gives his followers access to advanced tech for the betterment of humankind and what do they do with it, turn it into weapons and attack their rivals.

Also what they don't have in this time from the original lore is that the TR army battalion sent to overwatch all the dealings of the scientist and if necessary to eliminate them if they became a threat which they were instead mutiny against their high command and join the scientists to attack the TR they offer terms to the NC for a joint assault and instead receive the NC's disgust and disdain not to mention a lot of bullets and shells.

The VS weren't a peaceful bunch of geeks who wanted nothing but to be left alone, they went on the offensive.

So your opinion is kinda misplaced.


Originally Posted by Sabot View Post
We also invented the spawntubes you pop out of everytime said laser wepons turn you into a heap of smoking ash on the ground. So don't go judging us as nut jobs... at least we aren't fascists
I know it's most likey but this remains to be seen if the VS were responisble for rebirth tech or was it a joint effort before the split.
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Last edited by Canaris; 2012-06-09 at 03:22 AM.
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Old 2012-06-09, 03:44 AM   [Ignore Me] #95
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Well I had a pathological hatred for VS on Markov, with their Purple People Eater outfits looking like they had been designed by someone on a crack bender but I wouldn't say that they are out of place. As long as they were in my sights they were where they were supposed to be, and this was often the case.
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Old 2012-06-09, 04:00 AM   [Ignore Me] #96
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Think of ME3 ending - the only difference is the color. The 3 factions are all insane, just choose your fav flavor - dictatorship ala North Korea, "freedom fighters" crossing the terrorism line and a crazed sect of tech lovers that wish to commit genocide.
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Old 2012-06-09, 04:03 AM   [Ignore Me] #97
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


This guy didn't play PS1 so he may not realise that VS were always the under popped Empire. But that's where the challenge was! The lore is a party of that. It isn't as compelling as the other two Empires and as a 9 year VS vet I'm fine with that and i hope VS are the least popular once again.... Otherwise Delta Triad might end up NC!
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Old 2012-06-09, 04:06 AM   [Ignore Me] #98
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Originally Posted by Dart View Post
This guy didn't play PS1 so he may not realise that VS were always the under popped Empire. But that's where the challenge was! The lore is a party of that. It isn't as compelling as the other two Empires and as a 9 year VS vet I'm fine with that and i hope VS are the least popular once again.... Otherwise Delta Triad might end up NC!
except for the whole Lasher v.2 debacle, one of the few times the VS out pop'd both the NC & TR combined..... ugh
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Old 2012-06-09, 04:23 AM   [Ignore Me] #99
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


I don't need the Vanu to make sense! "Technology Equals Might" Is all I need to know.

On a serious note - VS was always the underdog on Emerald and I always liked being stuck between a rock a hard place = more targets for me FTW. Having a faction based on alien technology on an alien planet never seemed even slightly out of place to me.

I do hate cults and religion, and the VS are definitly on the verge (or beyond) of being a fanatical religious cult. I happen to hate the govment (TR) and hippies (NC) much more so VS has always been the choice for me


As far as lore goes - It seems to me like the defectors from the TR would naturally gravitate to the VS instead of the TR because seriously, Duct tape weapons and armor will only take you so far. I really don't see how you could have a 3rd faction make sense if it were not the VS. It balances everything out IMO.

Plus the fact that lazers (in my mind) = Star Wars = Awesome!!!
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Old 2012-06-09, 04:26 AM   [Ignore Me] #100
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Originally Posted by Dart View Post
This guy didn't play PS1 so he may not realise that VS were always the under popped Empire. But that's where the challenge was! The lore is a party of that. It isn't as compelling as the other two Empires and as a 9 year VS vet I'm fine with that and i hope VS are the least popular once again.... Otherwise Delta Triad might end up NC!
Fo Sho - Delta Triad was pretty awesome. I really hope to see them again in PS2!
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Old 2012-06-09, 12:06 PM   [Ignore Me] #101
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Originally Posted by Zekeen View Post
Best way to put the actual lore back into what the factions are.

Terran Republic - The original faction from which all originate. Forced into using harsh tactics and capital punishment for small offenses in order to cope with a terrorist threat that arose from the colony being separated from the main world.

New Conglomerate - Corporations who gathered oppressed civilians and rebelled as a result of the senseless violence from the Terran Republic's new laws and restrictions.

Vanu Sovereignty - Science based groups that tried to stay neutral from the conflict until uncovering ancient alien artifacts and decided to fight in order to prevent the other two factions from using them for warfare and their own gains (ironic isn't it?)

TR Goal - To reunite the republic and defeat the outlaws and rebels.

NC Goal - To beat back the Republic and reaffirm their own government based on individual liberty.

VS Goal - To stop the other factions and take hold of the Vanu relics as a means to elevate mankind to the next level.
All very respectable and, if they could reunite the people, give liberty in a new government, and advance as a species, then that would be just great.

Unfortunately, while optimistic, that situation isn't likely. Or realistic, given the factions' hatred.

Which leads me to point to my sig, which I believe actually came from this thread.
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You pick your Empire and fight for it. Not because they're the good guys but because they're your good guys.
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Old 2012-06-09, 01:28 PM   [Ignore Me] #102
LegioX
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


I always play the underdog team. Seems Vanu is the underdog in this game, since everybody plays NC/TR/. So i will go Vanu
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Old 2012-06-09, 02:56 PM   [Ignore Me] #103
Kirotan
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Let me give this a shot:

Advancement of Human Evolution through Science

We are already at that point. Thanks to modern medicine, people with conditions such as leukemia, heart disease, obesity, diabetes, etc. etc. are living longer than they would naturally. Now, this is a good thing. Everyone deserves the right to a healthy life, so don't take what I say next out of context. However, humanity's evolution as a species is only going to degenerate from this point because people with all sorts of disorders are passing these defective genes down to their children. It used to be that people who suffered from these maladies didn't survive long enough to breed, in most cases. It was survival of the fittest, natural selection, and evolution with small variance of genetic mutation.

In the 21st century, there is only one way for man to evolve: Gene therapy and/or genetic engineering. Taking a medicine for your high blood pressure is all fine and dandy, but unless someone actually alters that defective genetic code, you're going to pass your crappy health condition down to your children. This is why modern science such as mapping the human genome, cloning, being able to alter genetic code is so important in the modern day; it's a race to master manipulating our own genes before we breed ourselves into a worse life where our grandchildren are taking 25 pills a day for 20 different illnesses.

Vanu Rationality

The TR/NC "gloomy side" theory: The Vanu artifact indoctrinated the Sovereignty's lead scientists and now they're unwittingly following the will of an alien mind.

The VS "bright side" theory:

http://www.planetside2.com/news/nov282011backstory

In the days after the event I noted a startling change to my thought processes. My rational mind seemed as robust as ever, but I was able to see things from other points of view like never before. It was obvious to me that I had previously been completely myopic in so many areas of thought, and now felt a vastness of new interests and understandings flooding my consciousness. It was overwhelming at first, but I was able to discuss it in detail with Tom, who was able to help me a lot. This was another completely new experience; human interaction that affected me positively.
And a Cracked article: http://www.cracked.com/article_19860...viding-us.html (sorry no actual scientist here, so I'll have to use Cracked's very shallow and amateur article as an example).

Using an example of modern news media, it's easy to see humans are easily manipulated by pushing the right buttons based on our bias, personal experience, gender, ethnicity, and so forth. If someone believes something, all you have to do to reinforce their belief is repeat it over and over without bothering to conjure any new evidence to support it, and/or sit them down with like-minded people. It is very likely that the artifact simply "evolved" Henry Briggs brain past the point of normal human limits.

Being technologically advanced as the Vanu were, they probably had psychic/empathic links with each other. At that point, installing audio/video communicators and trying to explain through words and facial expressions was just...cumbersome. Link each other up mentally, and multiple Vanu understand instantly what each other thinks. Suddenly a class of 100 Vanu students knows what the Vanu professor means when talking about Gravity.

To summarize, the artifact is just a fancy Vanu piece of technology, and it did as its programming designed it to do; make contact with the living being and establish a psychic link to the collective. Henry Briggs only got a glimpse of it once, and will likely never again be "talked to" by the artifact because the artifact realized, "Wait, this sentient organism this isn't a Vanu. Ending psi-link."

So the real question at the end of the day is, "Who is right?" Is Vanu leadership indoctrinated, or were they "enlightened" by merely brushing up against a vast, intellectually superior alien mind? (We'd never know because that might stop the fighting!).

This links with the first section I posted, about overcoming natural human evolution hitting a wall by using science. In the 21st century, we are going to use it so everyone can live happy, healthy lives. By the time PS rolls around, I believe the Vanu artifact has instilled the idea of Human Evolution on the mental side. We all have our own blind spots formed by our opinions and bias, and by evolving humanity to be able to see the big picture objectively like Henry Briggs does is how I believe the Vanu Sovereignty intends to usher humanity forward. If we can all see the big picture and understand where each of us is coming from, all our reasons for fighting and discord would stop.

Vanu are not religious zealots(mostly)

Take yourself out of what you know about the game as a consumer. I'm pretty sure the Vanu leadership didn't say, "Hey we talked to a Vanu statue and that's where we're getting our orders from!" We only know that because of private journal entries.

Here's my transcript between 2 common VS soldiers:

Steve: "Hey did you hear about that presentation in Cairn Hall yesterday?"

John: "No, what was it about?"

Steve: "Some of the scientists we're guarding, one of them showed this old video from the 20th century, about some starship and its captain named Picard or something. Anyway, Captain Picard says, "Computer: Tea, Earl Grey, Hot" and holy crap, this cup of hot tea just appears in this niche in a wall!"

John: "Well yeah, it's fiction, you can't..."

Steve: "No man, listen, after the video, the scientist on stage is standing next to a device, right? And he says, "Tea, Earl Grey, hot" and a hot cup of tea appears, just like in the clip!"

John: "Well we can teleport through warpgates and maybe he just had it somewhere else..."

Steve: "No man, it gets better! They asked for a volunteer, and told the guy in the audience to ask for whatever dish he wanted, so he says, "Filet Mignon, medium rare, with a side of grilled asparagus and a baked potato topped with bacon, cheese, butter, and sour cream" and a plate materialized, just like he asked!"

John: "How the hell did these scientists come up with that?"

Steve: "He said they mastered a new aspect of nanites. Now they just don't rebirth us to get rid of alcohol poisoning after shore leave. They've programmed nanites to make food the way we want. No more of that slop in the mess hall!"

John: "Man, I can't wait. I would love some linguine with Andouille sausage in marinara sauce..."

Steve: "I gotta say being on security detail with these scientists is a lot more fun and interesting than I thought it was going to be. In fact, John, I wanted to talk to you about that..."

John: "I know what you're going to say. It's getting bad; between the TR and NC. I don't think these lab coats can stay neutral for much longer; they'll have to pick a side."

Steve: "So you've heard there's rumors they're picking their own side."

John: "I do. I heard most of the 336th and a large portion of the 118th Air division has gotten to test out new energy weapons and some secret flight craft, and that they really like what they see. And you know what? I think I'll stay here too. I want to get some of that nanite crafted food. In the last 2 years these scientists have made the quality of life better for all of us, enough that when I go back to Home base, I feel like something is wrong. It's like Command doesn't acknowledge any of their improvements. I can count on one hand all the improvements these scientists have made that have been implemented elsewhere."

Steve: "So if there's war, we're staying with the scientists."

John: "We're staying for the food. Okay, and the scientists."

Steve: "I'd like to add personally that I'm also staying with the scientists because one day they might make a ray gun that will make Linda less of a bitch when I zap her with it."

John: "Keep dreaming pal. One small step at a time."

That's your common VS soldier. He or she is someone that has seen with his own eyes what secrets science can unlock from the Vanu. A small portion of the VS are probably zealots still, but I'm just here for the food.

Last edited by Kirotan; 2012-06-09 at 03:12 PM.
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Old 2012-06-09, 03:22 PM   [Ignore Me] #104
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


There is somewhat of a religious bent to it now. They believe by harnessing Alien tech they can evolve humanity to the next level. And the TR an NC wouldn't agree with this so they just stands in their way.

As for them being superior in battle because of the tech. Newer experimental weapons are not always practical or better. It's obvious the new stuff has some advantages but also some flaws that have not been corrected yet. Like the energy weapons losing power over distance. Vanu believe in their tech though so are going to use it anyway.
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Old 2012-06-09, 05:36 PM   [Ignore Me] #105
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Re: The Vanu Sovereignty seems out of place.


Th VS believe that unless they do something about it, both NC and TR will destroy Auraxis with irresponsibility and oppression, respectively. If the VS were to be fanatics like you said, then why would any player fight for them. You would be making the VS out to be bad guy radicals who would do anything for their religion... I would not like the idea of playing as someone like that at all.

Edit: If you read the lore the VS want as much freedom as the NC, so that is why the VS declared war on the TR, and the TR would do the same to the VS if they knew the VS had broken off sooner, but the NC does not like the idea of altering mankind, so the NC declared war on the VS, and with the VS already not a fan of the NC's idea of "freedom", they were happy to join in!

Last edited by willaguy; 2012-06-09 at 05:47 PM.
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