Kill Cams - Page 11

Zulthus · 2011-10-04, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by Graywolves

Webcams are just dumb. You can learn what happened without them. If someone needs their hand held to learn how they died, they probably are just going to continue being bad at the game anyways.

I dunno, I find webcams pretty useful for long-distance contact...

Graywolves · 2011-10-04, 10:40 PM

Originally Posted by Zulthus

I dunno, I find webcams pretty useful for long-distance contact...

lmfao, freudian slip.

Raymac · 2011-10-05, 01:09 AM

Guys, I don't want to keep going over the same argument, but I just want to say this. Killcams are a great learning tool. You may disagree with that point, but for me it is a reality. Granted this is andecdotal, but the killcams in MW2 made me a much better player at that game. They not only sped up the learning process on things like where to go and where not to go, but also on how best to aim the different weapons, especially when it comes to leading your target. Simply writing that off as "bunk" is selling killcams short. Just because they won't improve your awesome skills doesn't mean they don't help anyone.

The devs can find a way to implement them that will help players like myself ("bad players"), but not nerf players like you. Then at the end of the day if it still doesn't work, they will take them out before launch. That doesn't sound very controversial to me at all.

Graywolves · 2011-10-05, 01:41 AM

Raymac has a point.

The majority of us have loads of experience on FPS. For some people the killcams might be very useful.

But I still would not want it in the form that MW or BF has it.

Helwyr · 2011-10-05, 02:26 AM

Originally Posted by Raymac

The devs can find a way to implement them that will help players like myself ("bad players"), but not nerf players like you. Then at the end of the day if it still doesn't work, they will take them out before launch. That doesn't sound very controversial to me at all.

If the bolded statement is true, then no there's no problem. IMO kill cams shouldn't impact the battlefield outcome in anyway beyond the dubious claim that it educates bad/new players on how to play better. But if Kill Cams acts as an intel tool in anyway without players being able to opt out of being seen on kill cams then I will not agree your statement is true and remain opposed to Kill Cams. I would think many others here would feel the same.

Traak · 2011-10-05, 02:57 AM

Noobs can always shriek and blubber in local chat to find why things went so terribly wrong. Someone usually will educate them.

Princess Frosty · 2011-10-05, 03:13 AM

This would inevitably lower the experience of the game for infiltrators, if you kill someone and they get to see your position that's really lame.

If you kill someone and the kill cam is suppressed somehow via an implant, then they're still going to know there's an infiltrator about, unless as an infiltrator you can choose to associate the death of an enemy to the last friendly shooting at him and give him a fake kill cam to divert attention away from you, that would be workable.

Traak · 2011-10-05, 03:37 AM

Yeah, another layer of slinking anonymity for the cloakers. I like that.

Tikuto · 2011-10-05, 04:25 AM

I would rather see what my team is doing instead of having a ragefit encouraged by a Kill Cam. :P

Zulthus · 2011-10-05, 07:47 AM

Originally Posted by Raymac

Guys, I don't want to keep going over the same argument, but I just want to say this. Killcams are a great learning tool. You may disagree with that point, but for me it is a reality. Granted this is andecdotal, but the killcams in MW2 made me a much better player at that game. They not only sped up the learning process on things like where to go and where not to go, but also on how best to aim the different weapons, especially when it comes to leading your target. Simply writing that off as "bunk" is selling killcams short. Just because they won't improve your awesome skills doesn't mean they don't help anyone.

The devs can find a way to implement them that will help players like myself ("bad players"), but not nerf players like you. Then at the end of the day if it still doesn't work, they will take them out before launch. That doesn't sound very controversial to me at all.

Yeah, I know. You've said it 20 times. I just don't think so. That's fine. And no, I didn't simply write any argument off. I keep giving my reasons, so quit trying to throw my arguments in the trash while putting yours on the pedestal. So, to compromise, there should be a period when you create your first character, you have say a month or so until killcams are disabled. Haven't learned by then, too bad.

Crator · 2011-10-05, 07:58 AM

Originally Posted by Raymac

The devs can find a way to implement them that will help players like myself ("bad players"), but not nerf players like you. Then at the end of the day if it still doesn't work, they will take them out before launch. That doesn't sound very controversial to me at all.

Originally Posted by Graywolves

Raymac has a point.

The majority of us have loads of experience on FPS. For some people the killcams might be very useful.

Originally Posted by Traak

Noobs can always shriek and blubber in local chat to find why things went so terribly wrong. Someone usually will educate them.

That's the main issue. Having to fall-back on the shoulders of another real player for help shouldn't be the primary method. But, I suppose I'm confused on what this really means in regards to kill cams.

Originally Posted by Zulthus

Yeah, I know. You've said it 20 times. I just don't think so. That's fine. And no, I didn't simply write any argument off. I keep giving my reasons, so quit trying to throw my arguments in the trash while putting yours on the pedestal. So, to compromise, there should be a period when you create your first character, you have say a month or so until killcams are disabled. Haven't learned by then, too bad.

That's not a bad idea, only allow the use of kill cams for the first month of play. If kill cams are being used to learn with. But they also stated they wanted to put them in for the fun of it.

Kran De Loy · 2011-10-05, 09:24 AM

Isn't the name of the cert/implant tree game supposed to be customization and sidegrades? Having a cert/implant that disabled kill cams smacks too much of a +power cert, having a cert/implant that enabled kill cams would be the same.

Having a time limit like the one month idea is also a bit unfair, but better than most ideas imo. Say instead that kill cams are disabled once a character becomes so and so old or such and such amount of training points are earned. That way it makes experienced good players give up the kill cam quicker since the devs said they wanted for people actively playing to earn points slightly quicker than the normal as a reward for .. well .. playing.

Kran De Loy · 2011-10-05, 09:34 AM

Oh btw: I fucking hate kill cams with a vengeance. While they may teach the unenlightened, they are just as effective to experienced players who in the end would be able to use them more effectively than a simple n00b and more effectively than a bad player will ever be able to. (assuming bad players means people that seem to have some sort of learning disability.)

And PS2 is an MMO, so the corporate masters will of course pressure the crap out of the dev team to cater to as many people as possible. As in The Lowest Denominator, not the common one either. I have faith in the Higby and T-Ray, but eventually there are always cracks when dealing with such high amounts of pressure that only the idea of a few million dollars can cause.

xSlideShow · 2011-10-05, 10:57 AM

Ok... so at this point in this whole kill cam debate I'm confused... People are afraid other players are gonna what give away their positions? You killed them... They know your there. They can see where the bullets came from anyway. Quit camping? 2nd ok, cloakers and their positions being given up. Again you killed some one they know your there. The only thing they've learned is where you were stand like 3-1 seconds before they died. So again quit camping? Your gonna have to reposition anyway...

The only people I can really side with having a problem with kill cams is snipers. If there is something I'm missing please explain in great detail because all I've read is the same thing over and over. And still it doesn't make sense.

By great detail I mean I need a diagram at this point cause you guys just seem to be bitching.

NapalmEnima · 2011-10-05, 11:34 AM

I think kill cams would be fine so long as they don't give away the position of the person that killed you. You could make adjustments to the cam based on the class/weapon that killed you.

Sniper rifle: Put the camera half way between you and the sniper. You still get an excellent idea of what you looked like to them, and which direction the shot came from (which is often the case with damage indicators and so forth anyway... plus that whole "agonizing pain" thing). What you don't get is a look at the scenery around them.

Knife: 3-5 seconds of them walking up behind you and sticking it in.

Infiltrator: Bullet time wrap around of you that ends with you looking in the right general direction.

And taunts could give you the full 3-5 seconds of their view prior to your death.

But all that is a lot more work.