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Old 2012-03-28, 02:13 PM   [Ignore Me] #1
SGTalon
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Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


I was just drooling on the TR Engie pics and had a thought.

I think i heard that there would be locational damage differences. (i.e. headshots, leg shots, etc)

Wouldn't different features on armor create similar issues? We already have it on the vehicles (Lightning weak on the back) Why not on the personal armor?

That backpack looks pretty beefy. Shouldn't back shots take less damage then? Similarly, that face mask looks very weak. You can see skin! Face shot should be the weakest armor, right?

This could be an interesting thing to spend station cash on too. Not sure if that would be edging into the pay to win thing or not... probably does.

But i think that this idea has some merit.
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Old 2012-03-28, 02:20 PM   [Ignore Me] #2
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Headshots only.

Getting shot in the foot or center mass will be the same.

Besides, broken legs and such are more of a pain in the ass then a cool feature.

Now they have stated that you will be able to add armor to vehicles which do have locational damage.
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Old 2012-03-28, 03:12 PM   [Ignore Me] #3
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by TheRagingGerbil View Post
Headshots only.

Getting shot in the foot or center mass will be the same.

Besides, broken legs and such are more of a pain in the ass then a cool feature.

Now they have stated that you will be able to add armor to vehicles which do have locational damage.
source???? most of the time when a game has hit boxes, its head, waist to neck,foot to waste. i assume planetside 2 will have the same... they did say shots to the back will cause bonus damage, not sure if they meant for armor or in general.
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Old 2012-03-28, 03:33 PM   [Ignore Me] #4
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Wait.. are you campaigning for buttshots on infiltrators?


Originally Posted by Rumblepit View Post
source???? most of the time when a game has hit boxes, its head, waist to neck,foot to waste. i assume planetside 2 will have the same... they did say shots to the back will cause bonus damage, not sure if they meant for armor or in general.
The only place I've seen "more damage for shots to the rear" was in regards to vehicles taking more damage to rear arcs, not infantry.

And while the game will (well, should) have hitboxes for limbs, that doesn't mean that the damage to them will be locational or adjusted in magnitude. The only thing we've got confirmed so far is headshots do extra damage.

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Old 2012-03-28, 03:34 PM   [Ignore Me] #5
TheRagingGerbil
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by Rumblepit View Post
source???? most of the time when a game has hit boxes, its head, waist to neck,foot to waste. i assume planetside 2 will have the same... they did say shots to the back will cause bonus damage, not sure if they meant for armor or in general.
Various sources. Read the "Information Thread" thread.
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Old 2012-03-28, 04:41 PM   [Ignore Me] #6
DviddLeff
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


**Shoots someone in the knees on the edge of a continent and leaves them to crawl back to base.**
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Old 2012-03-28, 04:48 PM   [Ignore Me] #7
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by SGTalon View Post
I was just drooling on the TR Engie pics and had a thought.

I think i heard that there would be locational damage differences. (i.e. headshots, leg shots, etc)

Wouldn't different features on armor create similar issues? We already have it on the vehicles (Lightning weak on the back) Why not on the personal armor?

That backpack looks pretty beefy. Shouldn't back shots take less damage then? Similarly, that face mask looks very weak. You can see skin! Face shot should be the weakest armor, right?

This could be an interesting thing to spend station cash on too. Not sure if that would be edging into the pay to win thing or not... probably does.

But i think that this idea has some merit.

Way too much work for very little pay off. This sort of feature works best in games with lots of HP so you can see the results and all that. In a fast pased, fast TTK style game, almost none of this would matter, and if it did, it would perceptually cause peopel to feel that somethig was unfair or wrong more times than not.

Could you imagine going for a head shot.. but shooting their ear, so barely doing any damage, and then going for it again, but hitting their jaw, only doing moderate damage...ect? I know that's extreme, but it's the same general idea.
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Old 2012-03-28, 04:53 PM   [Ignore Me] #8
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


What if removing ones helmet caused head-shots to do more damage? That would be cool.
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Old 2012-03-28, 04:57 PM   [Ignore Me] #9
Skitrel
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


It is completely unnecessary to have different damage for different limbs, if you get shot in the arm with an AR in real life you are just as likely to die as you are getting shot in the chest. Your arm will have been turned into a mangle fucked up mess and you will bleed out very quickly.

Regardless of realism, it adds nothing to the game, therefore is unnecessary. Name one game where you've noticed limb hitboxes and their valuable addition to gameplay during combat, ever.

Not once. All we need is a body hitbox for legs/arms/core and a head hitbox for headshots. Functionally this does everything you ever notice when actually playing the game.
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Old 2012-03-28, 05:17 PM   [Ignore Me] #10
Whalenator
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by Skitrel View Post
It is completely unnecessary to have different damage for different limbs, if you get shot in the arm with an AR in real life you are just as likely to die as you are getting shot in the chest. Your arm will have been turned into a mangle fucked up mess and you will bleed out very quickly.

Regardless of realism, it adds nothing to the game, therefore is unnecessary. Name one game where you've noticed limb hitboxes and their valuable addition to gameplay during combat, ever.

Not once. All we need is a body hitbox for legs/arms/core and a head hitbox for headshots. Functionally this does everything you ever notice when actually playing the game.
Depends on the realism and pace of the game. Arma 2 had pretty selective shots that could disable a soldier's legs, decrease their accuracy with an arm shot, etc. Since the pace of the game (A Military Simulator) was already pretty slow it was an acceptable ode to realism. Some mods even made it more selective -- Hand shots, Thigh shots, etc.

In this game though the pace has been sped up, even from an already moderate-paced game like the original Planetside... So no, selective hitboxes would be a waste of developer's time and server resources.
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Old 2012-03-28, 11:28 PM   [Ignore Me] #11
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by Skitrel View Post
Regardless of realism, it adds nothing to the game, therefore is unnecessary. Name one game where you've noticed limb hitboxes and their valuable addition to gameplay during combat, ever.
Mechwarrior.

Snark aside, though, yes -- there's clearly a threshold beyond which locational damage will not be worth modelling in this game. I feel that threshold is the headshot.

That said, this would still optimally use limb hitboxes -- they would just all be counted as "body" shots. But that doesn't make it one big box, because if I shoot between a guy's legs, I don't want the hit detection to register that as a hit.

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Old 2012-03-28, 11:39 PM   [Ignore Me] #12
Skitrel
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by kaffis View Post
Mechwarrior.

Snark aside, though, yes -- there's clearly a threshold beyond which locational damage will not be worth modelling in this game. I feel that threshold is the headshot.

That said, this would still optimally use limb hitboxes -- they would just all be counted as "body" shots. But that doesn't make it one big box, because if I shoot between a guy's legs, I don't want the hit detection to register that as a hit.
My god you had to go a looooooong way back to find one. You're correct, Mechwarrior added to the game with it. Though Mechwarrior wasn't particularly a game about fast paced fps was it? It was all about intelligent management of systems, heat and so on in order to deal damage while taking it, to the best effect.

Personally I think separate limb damage in fps games serves no purpose if you're not going to cause an effect on the player receiving the damage so that either the receiver of shooter notices it in gameplay, otherwise it's pointless. I also think that in a fast paced fps style game, leg or arm injuries would merely be an annoyance, and more to the point - completely unrealistic. As I mentioned, if your arm is shot up by an AR in reality you're just as lethally wounded as if your body was. I'd link some NSFL videos that clearly demonstrate this, it probably wouldn't be appreciated though, the curious can find them relatively easily, there is very, very little depiction of what actually getting shot is like, in TV or gaming. I really wouldn't recommend investigating it unless you're a seasoned internetter though with a history of shock video and imagery behind you, it would certainly be traumatising.
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Old 2012-03-29, 01:29 AM   [Ignore Me] #13
CutterJohn
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


I'd bet good money on MAX units being weak in the back rather than the head. They'd be sniper bait outside like Heavies are if they were vulnerable to headshots.
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Old 2012-03-29, 01:55 AM   [Ignore Me] #14
Pozidriv
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by Skitrel View Post
My god you had to go a looooooong way back to find one. You're correct, Mechwarrior added to the game with it. Though Mechwarrior wasn't particularly a game about fast paced fps was it? It was all about intelligent management of systems, heat and so on in order to deal damage while taking it, to the best effect.

Personally I think separate limb damage in fps games serves no purpose if you're not going to cause an effect on the player receiving the damage so that either the receiver of shooter notices it in gameplay, otherwise it's pointless. I also think that in a fast paced fps style game, leg or arm injuries would merely be an annoyance, and more to the point - completely unrealistic. As I mentioned, if your arm is shot up by an AR in reality you're just as lethally wounded as if your body was. I'd link some NSFL videos that clearly demonstrate this, it probably wouldn't be appreciated though, the curious can find them relatively easily, there is very, very little depiction of what actually getting shot is like, in TV or gaming. I really wouldn't recommend investigating it unless you're a seasoned internetter though with a history of shock video and imagery behind you, it would certainly be traumatising.
What kind of locational damage are we talking about? If it's something that causes extra / different side effects other than damage then there aint many contenders.

But quite a few games do have localized damage modifiers, BF3 has a 1x for center mass 0,9x for limbs and 2,5x (if memory serves) for headshots. Imho quite a few games have lower modifiers for limb shots.
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Old 2012-03-30, 06:07 PM   [Ignore Me] #15
TheBladeRoden
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Re: Weak spots/strong spots on soldier armor


Originally Posted by CutterJohn View Post
I'd bet good money on MAX units being weak in the back rather than the head. They'd be sniper bait outside like Heavies are if they were vulnerable to headshots.
I didn't think the glowy red parts on the back were just for show
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