Trayvon Martin

[WildGunsTomcat]

Originally Posted by Figment

So you are, as Malorn already was, insinuating that anyone attending rallies is a deranged racist, simply because one person apparently is? Isn't that... stereotyping?

Sure why not?

Isn't that what the majority of people are doing to Zimmerman?

He's a white guy with a gun, he MUST have profiled and stereotyped Trayvon Martin right?

He was chasing this poor little child down like a scared rabbit...his hate mongering, KKK loving conservative eyes glowing red with hatred for the black man.

Right?


Zimmerman was a democrat by the way...and a hispanic ***. He wasn't white.

[Figment]

Originally Posted by WildGunsTomcat

Sure why not?

Isn't that what the majority of people are doing to Zimmerman?

He's a white guy with a gun, he MUST have profiled and stereotyped Trayvon Martin right?

Well... As you can tell from the 911 tapes... He did profile and stereotype him as a criminal. (I personally presume based on wearing a hood). Hell, he saw a kid walk down the street, got suspicious and called 911.


Why? Why did he do that if the kid was just walking home while on the phone with his girlfriend?

He didn't talk to him yet, he hadn't stalked him yet then... What else could it have been aside from stereotype criminal appearance? You'd think behaviour would be one thing. But, rather than consider the idea that if you'd be stalked you'd start moving faster, the guy must have been fleeing. That too is a prejudice: a selective conclusion to fit the frame of mind.

From my perspective, Zimmerman was simply looking for observations that matched the conclusion he had already drawn: he had spotted a criminal, or as he put it "a real suspicious guy".


Racial hatred may have very little to do with it, from where I stand it could easily have been the "black gangsta" stereotype, of which ethnicity is not the main, but a sub-characteristic. As such, my concern is with Zimmerman triggering/provoking aggression by coming over in a threatening manner and then claiming self-defense. Would I consider it to be a planned murder? No. A racial murder? No. Self-induced manslaughter? Yes, possibly, as it seems to have been a bit of a self-fullfilling prophecy in terms of turns of events.

Anyway, I don't subscribe to the view of people (which you are calling racist) that say it'd be the main characteristic that triggered the train of thought. That's more like hijacking the topic for use in a political agenda. I'm more of the opinion that stress and adrenaline, combined with frustration and some paranoia lead to the incident. I don't think Zimmerman intended to kill him during the chase, perhaps not even as he shot: he probably just wanted some sort of justice being done for once and would probably have prefered the guy being arrested and not expected him to become aggressive out of fear, or whatever other reason.

However, what is clear is that Martin clearly had taken note of Zimmerman and that gave him enough reason to start running.

That's my theory anyway. I can't prove it, but it is in line with this transcript:
http://www.examiner.com/unsolved-cas...ll-transcribed

What exactly happened after that, what exactly made Zimmerman suspicious, that's up for debate.

He was chasing this poor little child down like a scared rabbit...his hate mongering, KKK loving conservative eyes glowing red with hatred for the black man.

Right?

I don't believe anyone in this thread claimed anything close to that.

Zimmerman was a democrat by the way...and a hispanic ***. He wasn't white.

Sure, but rather irrelevant, prejudism exist within everyone after all.

[Warborn]

Originally Posted by Malorn

Since many folks like to call George Zimmerman a racist, how would you classify this woman?

As a person who had a mental break and needed to be institutionalized. I don't see what the comparison you're trying to make here is. Are you saying Zimmerman needs to be locked up? That he's maybe schizophrenic and violently unstable like this girl might be? Or are you mad that society isn't up in arms over the things an insane person said during a fit of hysterics?

Originally Posted by WildGunsTomcat

Sure why not?

Isn't that what the majority of people are doing to Zimmerman?

He's a white guy with a gun, he MUST have profiled and stereotyped Trayvon Martin right?

He saw a black kid in a hoodie and called the police, describing him as suspicious, saying he looked like he was on drugs, and that he was up to something. None of that was true, of course. Then, as he chased Martin, he said "fucking coons" under his breath, and prior to that remarked how "these assholes, they always get away".

So... no? No, I don't think Zimmerman is being unfairly targeted as being a racist who stereotyped Martin. His friend tried to tell us that he said "fucking goons" and that "goons" is a term of endearment amongst highschool kids these days (note: Zimmerman is 28) and that race had nothing to do with it. But, neighbors had also described Zimmerman as telling them to be on the lookout for suspicious black people.

[Malorn]

Meh.

[Warborn]

http://open.salon.com/blog/chauncey_...more_crime_and

The killing of Trayvon Martin is a Rorschach test for American society. This tragedy reveals a deep divide in our political imaginations and communities. It also is a mirror for the fissures of race, ideology, and party that still vex and befuddle us to the present.

Some folks imagine themselves, their children, and members of their communities as Trayvon Martin. To their eyes, Trayvon is a symbol of how American society all too often devalues the lives of people of color.

Other people imagine themselves as George Zimmerman. To them, he is a "victim," a "good" man who only wanted to protect his neighborhood from crime and "suspicious" people. Moreover, the assertion that George Zimmerman acted out of racial bias in his hunting and killing of Trayvon Martin is personally offensive to them.

Because Zimmerman is “them,” and “they” are Zimmerman, he is quite simply a "law abiding" citizen who is being made a victim of "reverse racism," "race hustlers," and "the liberal media."

I thought this was a good article and pretty accurately describes how this whole thing appears to me.

[Figment]

But never say they might be biased! D:

For how could they be! Everyone else is biased! D:

[WildGunsTomcat]

I'm just gonna leave this here.

[Warborn]

It's Fox News. Nobody cares what Fox News has to say about any particular issue.

[Vecha]

Originally Posted by Warborn

http://open.salon.com/blog/chauncey_...more_crime_and



I thought this was a good article and pretty accurately describes how this whole thing appears to me.

I agree with the snippet from the article you showed...The whole politicizing of this whole thing is just sickening.

I personally feel I keep getting tugged in twenty different directions. Seems everyone is bringing their past emotional baggage into this debate...whether its racial tension issues or gun control issues(both sides).

[WildGunsTomcat]

Originally Posted by Warborn

It's Fox News. Nobody cares what Fox News has to say about any particular issue.

How very closed minded of you Warborn.

Why don't you read the bottom of the report:

The Associated Press contributed to this report.

Which means the AP reported it initially, and Fox News Re-Reported it (in their own words to avoid plagiarism and accusations that they steal their news from other news sources)

Why don't you stop with the bullshit hate of Fox News for a second, and read the report.

Edit:

Since you seem to be irrationally biased against Fox News...for obvious reasons...here it is at CBS news...it might be a little easier for your liberal sensibilities to see it at a liberal news source.

Liberal News Source For All You Liberals Out There.

I also want to say I love how you dodged the reported information that Zimmerman's story that he was under attack might have merit.

inb4 he was stalking and profiling....you've said it many times before.

[Warborn]

It's not bullshit hate of Fox News, it's legitimate disdain for a "news" company which in actuality is nothing more than the mouth piece of the mainstream Republican Party. If you're going to cite a source for something, don't cite a shitty source that nobody with any sense takes seriously.

You don't get a scrape on your head which doesn't bleed significantly and doesn't require medical attention from having your head bashed against concrete repeatedly. Zimmerman's injuries were, I suspect, as the police report suggests: Superficial injuries with slight bleeding to the nose and back of the head as a result. Not as his lawyer claims: A broken nose and a head that required stitches. However he got whatever may or may not be on the back of his head in that video, it wasn't as Zimmerman claimed.

[Zulthus]

Not to sound like an asshole, but I don't even see why people care about this guy. This shit happens DAILY in the US and nobody gives a fuck, but SUDDENLY they care SO MUCH about a dead black guy just because the media makes it into something big.

Not much to see here. Many, many people get murdered daily, and in many cases over racism. None of them justified.

[Baneblade]

It is called distraction. It is no accident this is happening right now, it takes attention from Obamacare being destroyed by the Supreme Court.

[WildGunsTomcat]

Originally Posted by Warborn

It's not bullshit hate of Fox News, it's legitimate disdain for a "news" company which in actuality is nothing more than the mouth piece of the mainstream Republican Party. If you're going to cite a source for something, don't cite a shitty source that nobody with any sense takes seriously.

You don't get a scrape on your head which doesn't bleed significantly and doesn't require medical attention from having your head bashed against concrete repeatedly. Zimmerman's injuries were, I suspect, as the police report suggests: Superficial injuries with slight bleeding to the nose and back of the head as a result. Not as his lawyer claims: A broken nose and a head that required stitches. However he got whatever may or may not be on the back of his head in that video, it wasn't as Zimmerman claimed.

Yeah, Fox News is a Republican mouthpiece..because all the other news outfits are so liberal its disgusting.

But I guess the repubs can't even have one eh?

Also, it adds weight to the fact that he was attacked.

And it also adds weight to the fact that, by Florida state law, he had every right to put a bullet in his attacker...because he had a CCL.

Case closed.

[Vash02]

Tom, if Zimmerman attacked Trayvon (Which, judging by Zimmermans words and actions, he did), did Trayvon not have the right to defend himself also? or does that law only protect the guy with the gun?

If you instigate the confrontation you should have to pay the consequences.