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Old 2013-05-30, 11:19 PM   [Ignore Me] #46
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Emperor Newt View Post
Thank you for watching todays episode of:
"The Internet, E-Penis and why nobody cares to argue"
Has nothing to do with E Peen...I never said my stats are so much better so I know more.

I just said, you don't even have 1000 kills with heavy Assault weapons, sorry you don't know what you are talking about.

Originally Posted by maradine View Post
When the argument degrades into "I'm looking at your stats to justify my argument", you automatically lose. It's like Godwin's Law for game forums. You've exhausted rational discourse and are now that guy.
It was about the Experience he has as HA.

So a guy who's HA weapon with most kills is TMG-50 at 177 kills and SVA-88 at 492 kills.....should act like he is an expert at HA?.....then says he has played more than me so he has more experience as HA?


If I say he had 7000 kills with different HA Guns, even if he had worst stats than me, I wouldn't mention it because he obviously has experience as HA but he doesn't.

Is like me going to a ESF thread and saying whats wrong and claiming things when I have no combat experience as an ESF pilot.

That was my point....and is valid.



Originally Posted by Varsam View Post
You talk a lot of smack for a guy that only plays HA (read: you know how to play 5% of this game), so I don't think you know much about anything.

If you wanna talk stats, I have a better SPM, KDR, and accuracy rating than you. So when I tell you that you're wrong and that asymmetrical design between faction is a good thing, go ahead and take a look at my stats. That's all the proof you should need apparently. I'll leave logical discourse to the people who've already invested the time in it in this thread, since you don't really listen to it anyway.
Talk a lot of smack?...lol..not sure if SRS.

I was just said the truth, the guy doesn't have the combat experience as HA yet he knows everything about HA.

You mention KDR/SPM....I never brought KDR/SPM because that doesn't matter in experience...If he had 7000 kills as heavy assault with different weapons and had KDR of 1.3....He at least has experience as HA....But he obviously doesn't have the Experience.
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Old 2013-05-31, 01:33 AM   [Ignore Me] #47
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
So yeah you might have more time playing Planetside 2( I played a lot in beta since August btw).....But I have kills,actual combat experience saying I know more about HA than you do.
Since you brought up beta play time. You are not some unique snow flake on these boards. A lot of us were in beta. I ran with the 666th Devil Dogs and Azure Twilight back in beta.

Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
Strafing is a huge advantage.

Specially when you have 2 shields like HA.

I know some Carbine weapons give .75 speed buff as well but it isn't a huge deal because they don't have 2 shields.

HA on the other hand, is just overkill to have 2 shields and a .75 speed buff.

I always ADAD Strafe...The best Players I play against ADAD Strafe...Most Vanu HA...They know that .75 speed buff is so legit.
Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
Has nothing to do with E Peen...I never said my stats are so much better so I know more.

I just said, you don't even have 1000 kills with heavy Assault weapons, sorry you don't know what you are talking about.

It was about the Experience he has as HA.

So a guy who's HA weapon with most kills is TMG-50 at 177 kills and SVA-88 at 492 kills.....should act like he is an expert at HA?.....then says he has played more than me so he has more experience as HA?

If I say he had 7000 kills with different HA Guns, even if he had worst stats than me, I wouldn't mention it because he obviously has experience as HA but he doesn't.
I will use your logic then. I clearly have more kills and time played in every other aspect of the game outside of TR HA than you.

The only class you can legitimately talk about according to your rules is TR HA. In every other aspect of the game you simply lack experience compared to me.

So back to square one. If I say that .75 ADS on a HA isn't a huge deal and isn't over powered because other classes can deal with it, then that is the end of the argument. You don't have any experience to justify any counter claim against that according to your rules here.

Which is the stance I have held from the beginning of this argument and I will requote it for you from page 1.

Originally Posted by Dragonskin View Post
People complain too much. The grass is always greener on the otherside until you get there. Take that from someone that plays on all sides. If your big hang up is that VS have the Orion with .75 ADS movement and 750rpm... get over it. Each faction has something that the other factions would kill for. Designed this way on purpose.
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Old 2013-05-31, 02:31 AM   [Ignore Me] #48
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Dragonskin View Post
Since you brought up beta play time. You are not some unique snow flake on these boards. A lot of us were in beta. I ran with the 666th Devil Dogs and Azure Twilight back in beta.





I will use your logic then. I clearly have more kills and time played in every other aspect of the game outside of TR HA than you.

The only class you can legitimately talk about according to your rules is TR HA. In every other aspect of the game you simply lack experience compared to me....so u have more experience than me.

So back to square one. If I say that .75 ADS on a HA isn't a huge deal and isn't over powered because other classes can deal with it, then that is the end of the argument. You don't have any experience to justify any counter claim against that according to your rules here.

Which is the stance I have held from the beginning of this argument and I will requote it for you from page 1.



I never said I was unique just saying I played this game more than wut my profile says, I also play on Alts.....Since you brought up that the time someone has played means a lot.

As how other classes deal with .75 HA...I know for a fact I kick their ass in ADS, way more than .50 HA.

But Checking your other kills based on other guns....You just manage to beat me...I wouldn't call you experience in Combat with other classes either lol.

You lack gun combat experience in Planetside 2.....as simple as I can put it.

You been wrong since the beggining of the thread, is quite obvious that you are acting like you know about HA and actual gun combat....because you think Im hating on the ORION only.

When In the beggining of the thread I talk about the NS-15.

You have no idea what you are talking about.

Thats the fact.
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Old 2013-05-31, 04:18 AM   [Ignore Me] #49
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
You lack gun combat experience in Planetside 2.....as simple as I can put it.
My gun experience is much greater and vastly more varied than yours. But you choose to ignore that because it's inconvenient for you.

Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
You have no idea what you are talking about.

Thats the fact.
It's clear at this point you have no clue what you're talking about, and you're too in love with yourself to admit otherwise. You don't even know the difference between fact and opinion. Let me help you. An example of opinion is when you interpret the data of dragonskin's stats and contrive meaning behind it. An example of fact is that you are now on my ignore list.
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Old 2013-05-31, 04:28 AM   [Ignore Me] #50
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Varsam View Post
My gun experience is much greater and vastly more varied than yours. But you choose to ignore that because it's inconvenient for you.



It's clear at this point you have no clue what you're talking about, and you're too in love with yourself to admit otherwise. You don't even know the difference between fact and opinion. Let me help you. An example of opinion is when you interpret the data of dragonskin's stats and contrive meaning behind it. An example of fact is that you are now on my ignore list.
lol...You are here because you think I said K/D ratio matters lol...when I never said that....You have mentioned nothing about what is discussed in this thread, inb4 you disagree with me.

Is quite simple DragonSkins stats show he has no gun experience in Planetside 2.....No HA experience.

You can compare your k/d ratio to mine all you want but I know I have gun experience to know what Im talking about.


Dragonskin, is just here talking like he knows what is he talking about because he thinks I only went after the ORION for some odd reason when I clearlyh mentioned the NS-15.

Dragonskin doesn't know much...but he is willing to say .75 ADS doesnt matter because I mentioned the word ORION...Thats his only reason.

You are only here because you think I judge Dragonskin because of K/D ratio lol.......
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Old 2013-05-31, 09:24 AM   [Ignore Me] #51
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


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Old 2013-05-31, 09:25 AM   [Ignore Me] #52
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Shamrock View Post
Nah just .75 ADS HA.
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Old 2013-06-01, 05:06 PM   [Ignore Me] #53
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


I've used most of the VS LMGs (and by used I mean I auraxied them).

I'm currently using the Orion on my way to Auraxium. I'll give it to the OP that the ADS buff is extremelly powerful. Strafing 50% faster than another LMG should be obviously powerful to anyone who has put any significant amount of time into this game.

What the OP is forgetting is that the Orion has a significant drawback as well. 50 bullet magazine with an insanely long reload time.

It's a specialized weapon - it murders close quarters on a 1v1, its pretty bad at many vs many.

This game isn't about 1v1s - weapon is fine as is.
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Old 2013-06-02, 01:36 AM   [Ignore Me] #54
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Ralek View Post
I've used most of the VS LMGs (and by used I mean I auraxied them).

I'm currently using the Orion on my way to Auraxium. I'll give it to the OP that the ADS buff is extremelly powerful. Strafing 50% faster than another LMG should be obviously powerful to anyone who has put any significant amount of time into this game.

What the OP is forgetting is that the Orion has a significant drawback as well. 50 bullet magazine with an insanely long reload time.

It's a specialized weapon - it murders close quarters on a 1v1, its pretty bad at many vs many.

This game isn't about 1v1s - weapon is fine as is.
I fail to see where the msw-r can over perform ther Orion in any situation.
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Old 2013-06-02, 02:16 PM   [Ignore Me] #55
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


OP has a valid argument actually but it's more of a MLG/e-sports argument. In regular situations, being the guy that gets the first shot is usually way more important than any ADS movement bonus. It's still an important bonus though and I'm pretty sure the current Orion/SVA-88 would be taken away from the game in MLG matches.
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Old 2013-06-03, 07:41 AM   [Ignore Me] #56
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Rolfski View Post
OP has a valid argument actually but it's more of a MLG/e-sports argument. In regular situations, being the guy that gets the first shot is usually way more important than any ADS movement bonus. It's still an important bonus though and I'm pretty sure the current Orion/SVA-88 would be taken away from the game in MLG matches.
The only realistic way they can run MLG is to only allow NS weapons and weapons that are uniform across the board like the sniper rifles and shotguns. Other wise the empire specific crap will throw off balance.

The OP talks about 1v1s like they happen all the time. They don't in reality. It's usually 1vmany or 2vmany. In those situations the Orion won't out perform to a degree that will make a huge difference. Nothing about this game is designed from a true 1v1 perspective and it never should be outside of MLG islands. The core game is about fun. If they wanted it balanced all the vehicles would have to go.. all the empire specific advantages would have to go.
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Old 2013-11-05, 08:48 AM   [Ignore Me] #57
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Falcon_br View Post
I fail to see where the msw-r can over perform ther Orion in any situation.
It can't.


VS has same RoF, more bullet velocity, higher ADS speed.


All those little advantages add up......No LMG should be that powerful.


Is ridiculous that an LMG has .75x speed.....Their HA have a nice advantage.

TR HA has zero advantage in gun combat over VS.
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Old 2013-11-05, 09:16 AM   [Ignore Me] #58
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
It can't.


VS has same RoF, more bullet velocity, higher ADS speed.


All those little advantages add up......No LMG should be that powerful.


Is ridiculous that an LMG has .75x speed.....Their HA have a nice advantage.

TR HA has zero advantage in gun combat over VS.
At least you have access to viable CQC LMG's. As NC we're pretty much screwed in that regard. I guess that's why we have the Jackhammer, IDK...
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Old 2013-11-05, 11:20 AM   [Ignore Me] #59
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


Originally Posted by Dreamcast View Post
It can't.


VS has same RoF, more bullet velocity, higher ADS speed.


All those little advantages add up......No LMG should be that powerful.


Is ridiculous that an LMG has .75x speed.....Their HA have a nice advantage.

TR HA has zero advantage in gun combat over VS.
erm the mcg ........

your obviously have little to no experience with the tr ha weapons as you forgot about that one
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Old 2013-11-05, 11:57 AM   [Ignore Me] #60
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Re: No Heavy Assault LMG deserves .75 ADS speed...VS.


I have spent a fair bit of time on all factions, particularly TR and VS(which use to be my main). It is my opinion that the Orion and SV-88 are the best LMGs the game has to offer at the moment for their respective niches. However, I wouldn't say the advantage that they provide is as great as the author insinuates.

I am going to ignore the NS lmg as I don't find it to be a good weapon making it rather irrelevant. You can easily make arguments for personal preference for certain traits but I think each faction has a better weapon for any situation you may be using it in.

A 33% strafing speed buff while ADS is a very strong benefit plain and simple. As the two LMGs already have excellent stats for their roles, it really sets them apart. It is going to make you harder to hit, thus increasing the chances you will survive any given engagement (assuming you take full advantage of it). It is something I notice whether going against or playing a VS heavy using one of these two weapons. I should probably mention that part of my reasoning for declaring these LMGs king is my firm belief that it is the close to medium range engagements that matter the most in this game (infantry wise), which is their territory.

This isn't to say that other factions cant compete or do not have their own weapons with their own benefits. All three factions have some great weapons to choose from, I just don't think the have as well rounded and benefits as the Orion and SV-88.

The biggest downside to the VS lmgs is mag size. Then comes the argument of at what point does the benefits of having a larger mag start to plain off, allowing other attributes to shine more. 100 rounds? 150? 200? My optimal set up would probably have at least 75 rounds (for squad play), then start putting the rest to reload speed. This gives enough rounds to take on a decent sized push or stream of players. At a certain point though I am going to want to reload to refresh my mag and don't want to go down because I am caught in a longer reload. I prefer weapons which allow me to reload in between engagements with out much penalty allowing me too maintain a more steady and faster pace.

This is why I am not bothered too much by the smaller mag size of the VS LMGs when it comes to my personal preference. I just don't feel the need for the extra rounds benefits me as much as the ability to spend shorter periods out side of the fight. Some people may feel different and want 150 rounds, which is fine and understandable. However these two traits are kind of in a tug of war with each other, so depending on where you stand on reload vs. mag side preferences, the VS movement speed buff may or may not be a flat out benefit.

If I had to pick an LMG to use and would be stuck with it. I would pick orion for solo or small squad play, SV-88 for full squad or platoon play, fallowed closely by the anchor then Carv. This is how I feel LMG balance falls for those close to med/long engagements (admittedly i haven't used the anchor in a while, but my outfit is on NC a fair bit and like the anchor over carv, but it easily be the other way around).

I personally think the VS are the clear cut winners, but its not by allot and nothing I am going to hold grievances over, especially in a game trying to emphasize faction traits.

Last edited by Badjuju; 2013-11-05 at 12:00 PM.
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