Please remove Vehicle seat swapping.

MrBloodworth · 2012-07-17, 02:56 PM

So as not to clegg up the other thread.

Make it Like the original.

If you do not have a full crew, you do not have full firepower. /end

fvdham · 2012-07-17, 02:58 PM

With yellow icons on the ground.

Buggsy · 2012-07-18, 09:42 PM

Originally Posted by fvdham

With yellow icons on the ground.

Agree. Instant hopping from one position to another, and no enter/exit animation, cheapens gameplay.

maradine · 2012-07-17, 02:59 PM

Please keep vehicle swapping.

Solo practitioners will not be able to deal with two threat classes at once.

Rivenshield · 2012-07-17, 03:46 PM

Originally Posted by maradine

Please keep vehicle swapping.

Solo practitioners will not be able to deal with two threat classes at once.

Good. Anything that promotes TEAMWORK is a good thing.

And yes, keep the user-friendly yellow entry icons on the ground.

Marinealver · 2012-07-18, 06:08 AM

Originally Posted by maradine

Please keep vehicle swapping.

Solo practitioners will not be able to deal with two threat classes at once.

Agreed, I actuall say add another seat and keep the swapings. Oh well we will find out what happens.

BorisBlade · 2012-07-23, 06:52 PM

Originally Posted by maradine

Please keep vehicle swapping.

Solo practitioners will not be able to deal with two threat classes at once.

Rarely do you have air and ground on ya at once, if ya do you are dead most likely anyway. What he and the rest of us mean is if you are, for example, fighting a tank then an aircraft comes in. You can magically instantly switch to AA meaning your main gun might as well just have an AA alt mode on it, there is no difference. You can instantly switch and take out the air then instantly switch back to the main gun for anything else. Same with any vehicle or weapon combo. You are a one man army. You have all the guns and can drive on top of that.

Whether you can do em at the same time is not really an issue, its whether you have the ability to instantly switch at any time to both AA/AV (or AI if you choose). Thats lame, and a huge flaw in those other standard boring FPS games. PS1 was the first to finally get it right with fixed vehicle slots and loading. Its really sad to see em keep sliding back into old sub standard gameplay mechanics. They should be going forward like they do with the improved infantry gun mechanics, and then building on forward with what PS1 had pioneered and finally got right. Battlefield is the old way, we dont need to copy that dinosaur.

Honestly this is far more important than enter/exit animations. Although its all part of the same thing. We should get the animations and fixed slots all in one patch.

Klockan · 2012-07-23, 09:31 PM

Originally Posted by BorisBlade

PS1 was the first to finally get it right with fixed vehicle slots and loading. Its really sad to see em keep sliding back into old sub standard gameplay mechanics.

Nah, they just copied what was popular at the time (Halo, which incidentally is older than the BF series). Now they just continue with that tradition.

Flaropri · 2012-07-17, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by MrBloodworth

If you do not have a full crew, you do not have full firepower.

Since you can't fire more than one weapon at a time, this is already the case.

MrBloodworth · 2012-07-17, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by Flaropri

Since you can't fire more than one weapon at a time, this is already the case.

Its not, as you can instantly swap to whatever suits the situation.

Flaropri · 2012-07-17, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by MrBloodworth

Its not, as you can instantly swap to whatever suits the situation.

Yes, but you can't fire all weapons at once. You don't have all firepower if you don't have a full crew. Being able to adapt is different from having full firepower.

Now, we can debate how quickly people should be able to adapt, but I think that saying that because people can switch seats they have full firepower is flat out incorrect. You can't fire a Lib's Nose, Belly, and Tail cannons all at once if you're the only person in it. You might be able to switch and use one of those, but you don't have your full firepower to bare (or the ability to fly well).

My take on it. Hotswitching is fine at the moment. If there is a problem, it could be with (especially tanks) making use of hotswitching to bypass reload times as a single player. The easiest way to fix that (if it is actually the case) would be to reset the reload time if the person switches, so it starts again from the beginning if/when they get back into that seat.

If there is a greater problem, having it default to reload regardless or even have an engine restart for pilot seat, could be a way to deal with it, but I don't think it's necessary from what I've seen so far (but play experience could change my mind).

I don't think there's a need to remove adaptability entirely, since there are obvious trade-offs with getting out of the driver seat to man a different weapon.

MrBloodworth · 2012-07-17, 03:27 PM

Originally Posted by Flaropri

You don't have all firepower if you don't have a full crew.

You have access to all available firepower even after loosing a man(s). I believe you are arguing semantics.

maradine · 2012-07-17, 03:30 PM

Originally Posted by MrBloodworth

You have access to all available firepower even after loosing a man(s). I believe you are arguing semantics.

Right. You didn't lose the gun. You have, on the other hand, lost 50% of the vehicle's simultaneous capability. It is now doing half of the things it was doing before. The difference is, the guy left behind gets to decide which is more important at the moment.

Synapse · 2012-07-17, 03:32 PM

Instant seat swapping seems a really poor idea to me, exactly because of the supporter's arguements.

Lots of discussion here is about tanks, but really we should be talking about the liberator. Seat swapping allows one guy to fly up over a base as a lib, jump over to the bomb seat, drop a bunch of bombs, and then back into the driver to fly away.

If doable at all, that should be extremely difficult. Personally I would rather solo liberators can't be done, but instant seat swapping makes that kind of stuff possible.

Zetsubo · 2012-07-17, 03:39 PM

The most natural (compared to real life) solution would be seat-swapped with delay. IRL, if your gunner gets hit and you need to take the enemy out, you do just that: park it in the best spot available and get on the gun. Same with aircraft: if your bomber's gone and you need to drop the load, the pilot puts it on auto and shifts seats.

Of course, IRL, all of this takes time. Question is, would putting real-life like timers be acceptable in game? Would you like to stare at you screen for a full minute while your guy makes the tranfers? Make crawling through the aircraft to the tail gunner spot a mini-game? All those things slow the player down from what he wants to do: play the game.

So best compromise seems to be swapping with a short delay, like between 1-5 seconds. Enough to not be instantaneous but short enough to not break the tempo of the gameplay. What exactly would be the sweet spot is anyone's guess.

But I'm pretty sure there is nothing less natural than not being able to switch seats in a vehicle.