Can this game render hundreds against hundreds ?? - Page 6

Mox · 2013-02-07, 02:46 PM

I am confused now:
We cant have weapon holster.
We cant have backbags.
We cant have a lattice.
We cant have real chokepoints.
We cant have defensible bases.

We miss all these major mechanics of ps....
But for what?
The game is still not able to offer massive fights.
Wtf.... Was there no progress in the last ten years?
If iam not wrong cpu speed as well as bandwith is at least 4 times bigger than a decade ago.
If you ask me something is terrible wrong here.

AThreatToYou · 2013-02-07, 02:53 PM

PS2 already offers larger battles than any other FPS, by at least 100 players. However, the LOD is a huge issue and MUST be addressed sooner rather than later.

VR Draco · 2013-02-07, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by Mox

Wtf.... Was there no progress in the last ten years?
If iam not wrong cpu speed as well as bandwith is at least 4 times bigger than a decade ago.
If you ask me something is terrible wrong here.

We use this power for MUCH MUCH smoother movement...if we had the same "net-code" like PS1 no one would play PS2, because it would be unplayable in terms of movement...

Ironside · 2013-02-07, 03:07 PM

Originally Posted by MrBloodworth

People smarter than you, apparently.

smarter than me at pulling the wool over everyones eyes it seems

Ghoest9 · 2013-02-07, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by basti

Dude, the nonsense you talk is indeed utter nonsense.

The server cant ignore interactions between you and someone else, because there is nothing to ignore.

Listen to me, and get it already: This is NOT a Server power issue, this is purpley a Network capacity of both server/client and a Client CPU limitations.

The server cant send out updates of all 400 players to all 400 players within a big battle, its simply to much. It would cause massive package loss if you try.

He had this bloddy topic several times already, and several times devs came along and cleared it up.

What you are saying is sort of right - but this issue is not client - its all SOE side. Im sure there could be a client limit but we are not close to it.

By the way I never said the word "server power." I think its kind of a semantic issue as to where the server buses or what ever SOE side network hardware are the limit or as opposed to to server computing power - Its hardware issue on their side and there is no current solution barring improvements in equipment.

Figment · 2013-02-07, 03:28 PM

Originally Posted by VR Draco

We use this power for MUCH MUCH smoother movement...if we had the same "net-code" like PS1 no one would play PS2, because it would be unplayable in terms of movement...

Yes, but that doesn't determine the general gameplay beyond less people abusing the netcode with net-limiters.

Tatwi · 2013-02-07, 04:17 PM

Any time data is transmitted in serial the ability simulate a real time environment gets exponentially less possible as data sources and destinations are added. The protocols used on the internet are not capable providing the massive parallelism that is required to maintain true real time performance on all clients in PS2, so developers need to use what is available to simulate a real time environment as best as they can. Could SOE do this better? Probably a little, but there the margins are so small for the transmission alone that it leaves them with little time to process any required calculations - remember, serialized data can never actually BE real time beyond the first byte.

In other words, they are doing the best they can with what they are trying to do and what they advertised may well be impossible to achieve.

bpostal · 2013-02-07, 05:08 PM

Originally Posted by AThreatToYou

PS2 already offers larger battles than any other FPS, by at least 100 players. However, the LOD is a huge issue and MUST be addressed sooner rather than later.

I agree that this needs to be addressed but are you also including Planetside in your list of FPS?

To me, personally, Fuck Battlefield, Fuck COD, Fuck TF2 and Fuck BLOPs in it's stupid fucking face. Fuck every other FPS on the market. The stick that this game should be measured by is Planetside 1. That is the only game that matters.

Rivenshield · 2013-02-07, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by Mox

Ps1 could handle bigger crowds than ps2. Therefore, ps2 is a step backwards regarding its main feature. Massive fights yeah but please not too massive. Haha, that would be an honest slogan.

/bangs head on desk

Hamma · 2013-02-07, 07:03 PM

Originally Posted by Mox

I am confused now:
We cant have weapon holster.
We cant have backbags.
We cant have a lattice.
We cant have real chokepoints.
We cant have defensible bases.

We miss all these major mechanics of ps....
But for what?
The game is still not able to offer massive fights.
Wtf.... Was there no progress in the last ten years?
If iam not wrong cpu speed as well as bandwith is at least 4 times bigger than a decade ago.
If you ask me something is terrible wrong here.

This in no way contributes to the discussion. Be warned we are cracking down on pointless negativity and "omg PS2 isn't PS1 because X" posts and threads.

Please also try and keep things constructive.

Mox · 2013-02-08, 01:38 AM

Originally Posted by Hamma

This in no way contributes to the discussion. Be warned we are cracking down on pointless negativity and "omg PS2 isn't PS1 because X" posts and threads.

Please also try and keep things constructive.

Sorry if i had sound like a drama queen.
The point of my post was to ask where the performance of todays networks and cpus is gone in case of ps2 since it seems that ps1 could offer some really high performance game mechanics and grafics.

The answer i get so far is ps2 offers smoother movements.

Now i want to ask:
Is it really that much smoother?
Is it worth to have smoother movements if we loose a lot of other interesting game mechnics instead?

By the way my thesis is that the performance issue of ps2 is caused by bad coding and wrong design decisions and not by smoother movements. Call that negativity if you want.
Talking about bad design decisions i mean e.g. too short TTK, too small maps, too hight travel speed.
One can say now that this is the way modern shooter are build but i would say that if we really want these massive battles like in ps1 we may have to resign some of these "modern shooter" mechanics.

But yeah i know that it is too late to change things like that and therefore it is not constructive talking about.

PredatorFour · 2013-02-08, 04:32 AM

Fair enough they designed the game with hexes to spread the fighting over big area's so they could fit everyone on the map. Designing more continents will spread the fighting over multiple conts like the first, so you`d think the render bug wouldn't matter as much.

The big issue will be when big outfits purposely get everyone in one hex to abuse this problem. Could you imagine flying to Amerish to resecure, seeing the base is empty only to get pummeled by a gazillion aa maxes/ aa heavies as they appear within 15m of you.

Another issue is Indarside. Will people ever leave that cont even when new conts come out ? As someone said Amerish is their fave cont and i agree it's nice .... but hardly ever fight there. I wonder if Indar will become the new 'Cyssor', a neutral cont that everyone always seems to go to fight. As long as everyone is drawn to Indar, this bug will be quite prominent.

Rolfski · 2013-02-08, 05:38 AM

Originally Posted by Hamma

Be warned we are cracking down on pointless negativity and "omg PS2 isn't PS1 because X" posts and threads.

Please also try and keep things constructive.

That's good to hear actually. This forum could do with less repetition of the same old bitter complaints over and over again that doesn't add anything to a constructive discussion on how to improve the game.

Back on topic: I'm fairly convinced the devs are working on the limit of what they can do to as far as scale and rendering distance goes. Seems to me that they have reached a give-or-take level atm: (give more scale, take more rendering or the other way around).

Sledgecrushr · 2013-02-08, 05:45 AM

The thing is that once in a while big fights will happen. Will soe be able to make these big fights fun and interesting or will the be a render nightmare from here on out. To me the entire sucess of this game hinges on this issue because everyone is going to be involved in these big fights. Everyone will either come away saying this was the greatest gaming experience of my life OR this game is horribly broken when it comes ro big fights.