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View Poll Results: What do you identify yourself as? | |||
Atheist/Skeptic/Agnostic | 151 | 70.89% | |
Catholic | 21 | 9.86% | |
Protestant | 24 | 11.27% | |
Jewish | 5 | 2.35% | |
Muslim | 2 | 0.94% | |
Philisophy (Such as Buddhism) | 10 | 4.69% | |
Voters: 213. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-07-05, 02:07 PM | [Ignore Me] #931 | ||
Theist: "I know how and why the universe was created and what the creator of the universe wants us to do."
Atheist: "Prove it." Theist: "You'll just have to take my word for it, as I don't have any proof that distinguishes my religion from the countless religions which have come before it." Atheist: "Oh. Well I don't believe you then." Theist: "You are arrogant for applying the same standard of evidence to my religion that you'd apply to anything else." Atheist: *is arrogant and possibly a character from Cheers* |
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2012-07-05, 08:30 PM | [Ignore Me] #932 | |||
Lieutenant General
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Zulthus wrote that. It has been mentioned even on this page. You didn't take the effort to verify yet made a related certainty claim. Definitely not on the side of science, nor skepticism (you make an unargumented hearsay claim and called it almost certain), but instead apply bias. You continue to disappoint me, young wannabee skeptic grasshopper. Ps: Warborn, you just made the same nuance mistake as therandomeone: confused skeptic with atheist. That might be the reason to be atheist, but doesn't have to be. But yes, that is the "consistent skeptic (strong) atheist's" position. Last edited by Figment; 2012-07-05 at 08:35 PM. |
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2012-07-06, 12:53 PM | [Ignore Me] #933 | ||
No, I didn't. I didn't say what I wrote was the response every atheist on the planet might give when confronted with someone calling their position "arrogant". It's no doubt the vast majority, but I am well aware of the scope of belief (or lack thereof) within the atheist demographic. If you feel your lack of belief is due to something other than a dearth of evidence in favour of religious belief, you're more than welcome to clarify your position.
I also take exception to that being a strong atheist position. I didn't assert that there is definitely not a god or gods. It's possible to be unconvinced by religion and not believing in god without being sure that no gods exist. Last edited by Warborn; 2012-07-06 at 12:55 PM. |
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2012-07-06, 08:16 PM | [Ignore Me] #934 | |||
Sergeant
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It's actually kind of sad the pride you take in proving a sarcastic comment wrong, but I guess since you couldn't debate with logic before, you really needed that one. So...feel better about yourself even though when I was actually debating you couldn't touch my arguments. |
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2012-07-06, 10:08 PM | [Ignore Me] #935 | |||
Colonel
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It would be difficult to determine how they approach aliens though. I would be misrepresenting them actually if I said they acted one way other another every time. I'm sure there are diehard alien hunters that believe they've seen aliens and that's all the proof they need. However even going into this conversation is kind of a trap when talking about atheists as a group.
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[Thoughts and Ideas on the Direction of Planetside 2] Last edited by Sirisian; 2012-07-06 at 10:22 PM. |
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2012-07-07, 12:30 AM | [Ignore Me] #936 | |||
Sergeant
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http://www.setileague.org/general/drake.htm To believe God exists you have to throw induction and abduction out the window, which is why it is illogical to believe God exists. Its really not that hard to comprehend if you understand any semblance of logic. |
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2012-07-07, 01:00 AM | [Ignore Me] #937 | |||
Sergeant
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Edit: I don't know if you realize this, but engineering is science.... Last edited by therandomone; 2012-07-07 at 01:01 AM. |
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2012-07-07, 02:05 AM | [Ignore Me] #938 | |||
Contributor First Sergeant
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Meanwhile, a theist's explanation for why there is a god is "What else could it be?" Damnit... I was clean for nearly a month. Why did I post again??
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NivexTR - TR - 30/5 - -=The Black Sheep=- SYNxNivexQ - NC - 26/4 - [:::::SYN:::::] NivexVS - VS - 19/2? - SYNDICATEVS? http://www.twitch.tv/nivexq I don't broadcast much, but you never know Last edited by NivexQ; 2012-07-07 at 02:07 AM. |
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2012-07-07, 02:10 AM | [Ignore Me] #939 | ||
Colonel
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Ever heard someone say "Ah, if I saw some miracle, then I'd believe in God.
Actually, no. It isn't miracles that cause faith to come. It is God's Word that causes faith to come. Luk 16:19 There was a certain rich man, which was clothed in purple and fine linen, and fared sumptuously every day: Luk 16:20 And there was a certain beggar named Lazarus, which was laid at his gate, full of sores, Luk 16:21 And desiring to be fed with the crumbs which fell from the rich man's table: moreover the dogs came and licked his sores. Luk 16:22 And it came to pass, that the beggar died, and was carried by the angels into Abraham's bosom: the rich man also died, and was buried; Luk 16:23 And in hell he lift up his eyes, being in torments, and seeth Abraham afar off, and Lazarus in his bosom. Luk 16:24 And he cried and said, Father Abraham, have mercy on me, and send Lazarus, that he may dip the tip of his finger in water, and cool my tongue; for I am tormented in this flame. Luk 16:25 But Abraham said, Son, remember that thou in thy lifetime receivedst thy good things, and likewise Lazarus evil things: but now he is comforted, and thou art tormented. Luk 16:26 And beside all this, between us and you there is a great gulf fixed: so that they which would pass from hence to you cannot; neither can they pass to us, that would come from thence. Luk 16:27 Then he said, I pray thee therefore, father, that thou wouldest send him to my father's house: Luk 16:28 For I have five brethren; that he may testify unto them, lest they also come into this place of torment. Luk 16:29 Abraham saith unto him, They have Moses and the prophets; let them hear them. Luk 16:30 And he said, Nay, father Abraham: but if one went unto them from the dead, they will repent. Luk 16:31 And he said unto him, If they hear not Moses and the prophets, neither will they be persuaded, though one rose from the dead. Oh, but there's more! Rom 10:12 For there is no difference between the *** and the Greek: for the same Lord over all is rich unto all that call upon him. Rom 10:13 For whosoever shall call upon the name of the Lord shall be saved. Rom 10:14 How then shall they call on him in whom they have not believed? and how shall they believe in him of whom they have not heard? and how shall they hear without a preacher? Rom 10:15 And how shall they preach, except they be sent? as it is written, How beautiful are the feet of them that preach the gospel of peace, and bring glad tidings of good things! Rom 10:16 But they have not all obeyed the gospel. For Esaias saith, Lord, who hath believed our report? Rom 10:17 So then faith cometh by hearing, and hearing by the word of God. It's the same mechanism that is used in advertising, propaganda, and anything else that is designed to increase your belief in something: Get your attention focused on something Keep it focused there. This is what will determine what you believe. Before you become a mouthpiece for what others believe, are you actually one of them? Do you know from first-hand experience that what they are touting is wonderful? Or are you just parroting what others say because you've had it pounded into you day and day out? I mean, do you really LIKE Coca-Cola? I, for one, know that I like cola. It's my favorite berry flavor. (Cola berries are where they get the flavor). I like the smell of it, the taste of it, and I even like the color, (and the caffeine, something ALSO contained in Cola berries) regardless of the brand, if it tastes good, I like it, so I don't find Coke's advertising to really be objectionable. But, what in my life do I do out of habit, agree with out of herd mentality, or approve of without knowing what it's really about? How do I know which way to go with something? The Word of God. Infallible, unimpeachable, and useful for all things. By ordering my life by God's Word, who knows it all and has seen it all, I know I'm going the right way. And I don't wait for signs or angels or miracles or whatever to direct me. That is not New Testament, and it is not the way God leads Christians. God can lead you with signs if you are an unbeliever/heathen/sinner/backslider/agnostic/atheist/pagan/whatever you are. God loves all people the same. He sent Christ to die for all, not just the pretty and the perfect. In fact, God has one Bible-approved way to prove him. It's contained in Malachi. Mal 3:9 Ye are cursed with a curse: for ye have robbed me, even this whole nation. Mal 3:10 Bring ye all the tithes into the storehouse, that there may be meat in mine house, and prove me now herewith, saith the LORD of hosts, if I will not open you the windows of heaven, and pour you out a blessing, that there shall not be room enough to receive it. Mal 3:11 And I will rebuke the devourer for your sakes, and he shall not destroy the fruits of your ground; neither shall your vine cast her fruit before the time in the field, saith the LORD of hosts. Mal 3:12 And all nations shall call you blessed: for ye shall be a delightsome land, saith the LORD of hosts. Give God 1/10th of your income and he will prove to you that he is God, by blessing you abundantly. Your harvests, aka all that you have worked so hard to get, will not be coming at a bad time, or being stolen off the vine or falling on the ground, as the case may be. Let's say, for example, you want to marry the right person, and not the 2,999,999,999 wrong ones. Pay tithes to God, aka give ten percent to a preacher or ministry where God is actually moving, not some dead, dry place where no miracles ever happen, no healings take place, and nothing supernatural ever occurs, and watch God work. This is the ONE way he said in his Word that you could prove him. Don't bother asking for signs, Jesus ain't down with that. Mat 16:1 The Pharisees also with the Sadducees came, and tempting desired him that he would shew them a sign from heaven. Mat 16:2 He answered and said unto them, When it is evening, ye say, It will be fair weather: for the sky is red. Mat 16:3 And in the morning, It will be foul weather to day: for the sky is red and lowring. O ye hypocrites, ye can discern the face of the sky; but can ye not discern the signs of the times? Mat 16:4 A wicked and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given unto it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas. And he left them, and departed. What was the sign of Jonah the prophet? Mat 12:39 But he answered and said unto them, An evil and adulterous generation seeketh after a sign; and there shall no sign be given to it, but the sign of the prophet Jonas: Mat 12:40 For as Jonas was three days and three nights in the whale's belly; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. Jesus came back from the dead. The only time in history where someone was resurrected without a prophet of God intervening directly. So what did they do when this, the greatest sign ever, happened? Mat 28:11 Now when they were going, behold, some of the watch came into the city, and shewed unto the chief priests all the things that were done. Mat 28:12 And when they were assembled with the elders, and had taken counsel, they gave large money unto the soldiers, Mat 28:13 Saying, Say ye, His disciples came by night, and stole him away while we slept. Mat 28:14 And if this come to the governor's ears, we will persuade him, and secure you. Mat 28:15 So they took the money, and did as they were taught: and this saying is commonly reported among the **** until this day. When Jesus rose from the dead, did the VERY SAME PHARISEES AND ELDERS who had asked for a sign fall down on the ground, worshiping God? Proclaiming that Jesus must, after all, be the Christ (Messiah, same thing)? No, they bribed the soldiers who had witnessed it first hand to LIE ABOUT IT AND SAY IT DIDN'T HAPPEN. So, the conclusion is this: God's Word is truth, and from it faith comes. Asking for a sign is futile, because as you can see from the Bible, it doesn't work. They didn't believe even after they had the EXACT SIGN THAT JESUS SAID WOULD BE GIVEN THEM. Goodbye, signs, hello Word of God. You live by the Word, and signs follow YOU, not the other way around. Mar 16:19 So then after the Lord had spoken unto them, he was received up into heaven, and sat on the right hand of God. Mar 16:20 And they went forth, and preached every where, the Lord working with them, and confirming the word with signs following. Amen.
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Bagger 288 |
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2012-07-07, 11:28 AM | [Ignore Me] #942 | |||
Sergeant
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"Saying "prove that the sum of all stuff is God" is as pointless as saying "prove that the star we orbit around is the Sun". They're just words, words of which we control the meaning." First off, they're not just words. Saying we orbit around the Sun can be proven, you can't prove the sum of all stuff is God. Take a logic course you retarded fuck. Using the bible to prove God exists, is no better than using Harry Potter books to prove Hogwarts is real. |
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2012-07-07, 11:50 AM | [Ignore Me] #943 | ||
Sergeant Major
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I lean more towards agnostic theism. I think outright atheism is illogical. You will never know (through scientific means) if God(s) are real. If there is indeed a God(s)-like entity, then it would have the power to partition itself from human (or other species) observation. Even though science has gone pretty far in terms of explaining the origin of our universe, it still leaves a lot unanswered.
I believe in the Big Bang, I think there is enough evidence to support its existence. I also believe in natural selection as well. Here's the catch: You go back far enough and what do you get? Big Bang came from nowhere - magic. If the Big Bang resulted from two or more universes in a multiverse colliding or some other strange event - then where did those universes come from? Magic. If the universe is infinite and has always existed and goes through repeated phases of being born, expanding and dying, to being born again, how did it get here? Magic? We try, as humans, to make to big of a distinction between science and religion when it comes to our origins, but for every phase of our evolution that we try to explain, we end up going all the way back to a point where all we can do is wonder: how? How did it all get here, why is there something instead of nothing? God? There's also the argument that if God is eternal and has always existed and created the universe, then why couldn't the universe be the same, that is, eternal? Some of us think we have "enlightened" ourselves by rejecting the idea of a deity and adopting the idea of atheism, when in reality both sides are completely arrogant if they 100% believe that their opinion is right. A 100% Atheist is as big of a dumbass as a 100% Christian that takes every line in the bible as literal and not metaphorical truth. The simple reason for that is because we as humans are too small and not advanced enough to even begin comprehending the answers to our universe. We may never know 100% of the answers. I think of the universe and I think of an infinitesimally interchanging system of dimensions and manifestations. We can claim to have it figured out, string theory stating that the universe is 11 dimensions and all, but the question arises again - What created those 11 dimensions? Magic? There may NEVER be an end-all explanation to how the universe(s) got here, so blatantly accepting any doctrine of religion, be it Christianity, Islam, or Atheism, is ignorant. Blatantly accepting science is also ignorant. There may be universes in which all of our scientific rules are completely different, and we may never find out of there existence. Last edited by MasterChief096; 2012-07-07 at 11:53 AM. |
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2012-07-07, 02:38 PM | [Ignore Me] #944 | |||
Sergeant
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What you still fail to realize is that you are making assumptions without proof. And finally, why would I try and impress a fool? It's more fun to illustrate your stupidity. So I go back to one of my original statements, and I ask, are you fucking retarded? |
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2012-07-07, 03:24 PM | [Ignore Me] #945 | |||
Sergeant
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I'm sorry you mistake my being right as trolling,that is through no fault of my own. I can guess rationalizing it as trolling is the only way you protect yourself from realizing how terribly wrong you are. As for my insults, im not trying to Braveheart you with them so, like every other point you've made, is moot. Edit: Better yet,by your definition of words can be whatever we want then this following group of words is a sentence. The dog blue arm heal yet side jab vampire poop. There, with your logic I just discussed the potential discovery of the higgs bosom particle. Last edited by therandomone; 2012-07-07 at 03:28 PM. |
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