Customization Woes - Page 7

LostAlgorithm · 2012-05-06, 11:30 AM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

But that isn't what you are saying. You want there to be a market for people that don't care, and a market for those that want to ignore those that don't care. These are exclusively different markets, and appealing to both means coming up with seperate products for each, rather than products which can be sold to both at the same time.

Again, not necessarily.

Just because I dislike some customizations doesn't mean I dislike them all.

And just because others like most customizations doesn't mean they like them all.

The system that I described above could be used by both to determine specifically which customizations show up. Players dig that kind of control.

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 11:32 AM

Originally Posted by Kipper

An effective compromise may be that you have to own every customisation you don't want to see, so if you don't like santa hats, you'd have to buy one to be able to turn it off - but I suspect keeping the game 'pure' would get mighty expensive then!

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

Again, not necessarily.

Just because I dislike some customizations doesn't mean I dislike them all.

And just because others like most customizations doesn't mean they like them all.

The system that I described above could be used by both to determine specifically which customizations show up. Players dig that kind of control.

Even this is a little rocky. If Player A is a dick, so much so that 5 people want to buy a "Player A is a dick" shirt, they might think twice because Player A might have bought said shirt just to be further of a dick, or turned the option for the "Player A is a dick" shirt off. So that potential 10$ that Player A spent, if on the shirt or the ability to turn skins off, might cost 50$ in potential sales.

It's much easier to just force skins to be seen and make sure that skins which are popular aren't ones that are immersion breaking.

LostAlgorithm · 2012-05-06, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

It's much easier to just force skins to be seen and make sure that skins which are popular aren't ones that are immersion breaking.

How do you ensure that the skins that are immersion breaking aren't popular?

Seems even easier to me not to have any skins that are immersion breaking.

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

How do you ensure that the skins that are immersion breaking aren't popular?

Seems even easier to me not to have any skins that aren immersion breaking,.

By offering a wide variety of skins that fit within the universe, and a small amount of extravagant or gag skins. Price the extravegant or gag skins higher since they are less likely to be bought, so when they are they still make enough to justify their creation. And price the options that offer more freedom to customize skins higher as well to prevent abuse.

Games like Gunbound have done similar things I believe. Players had to spend more to be more extreme and unique. And when Christmas rolled around they had to spend more to have Christmas themed items. The further they deviate from what a normal character should look like, the more they had to pay.

There will be skins that don't fit within PS's universe, players like having options in things to buy, our only hope is that they are made rare in proportion to how far they fall outside the universe.

LostAlgorithm · 2012-05-06, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

By offering a wide variety of skins that fit within the universe, and a small amount of gag skins. Price the gag skins higher since they are less likely to be bought, so when they are they still make enough to justify their creation. And price the options that offer more freedom to customize skins higher as well to prevent too much abuse.

Have you seen how crazy the TF2ers go over the newest crazy hat? I doubt that these people care about price, they simply see a Pirate Hat, or Kitty Ears, or a gun that shoots cows and decide "I must have that!"

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 11:57 AM

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

Have you seen how crazy the TF2ers go over the newest crazy hat? I doubt that these people care about price, they simply see a Pirate Hat, or Kitty Ears, or a gun that shoots cows and decide "I must have that!"

That is the audience that TF2 appeals to, and crazy hats aren't outside of TF2's universe as well. That audience helps TF2 survive and be successful. These kinds of people will likely be in PS2 as well, and will likely be a minority, but that doesn't mean they should be shut out and ignored if they will pay for something.

LostAlgorithm · 2012-05-06, 12:03 PM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

That is the audience that TF2 appeals to, and crazy hats aren't outside of TF2's universe as well. That audience helps TF2 survive and be successful. These kinds of people will likely be in PS2 as well, and will likely be a minority, but that doesn't mean they should be shut out and ignored if they will pay for something.

But the players who want to be able to hide customizations like that, who will admittedly likely also be a minority, should be shut out and ignored if they will pay for something?

Ceska · 2012-05-06, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

I'm sorry, but seasonal fun items like Santa hats, as you argued for, won't make sense no matter how you spin it. I can respect that players want that kind of customization for themselves, all I ask is that I have the option to avoid it.

We had santa hats in Planetside... People liked it.

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 12:12 PM

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

But the players who want to be able to hide customizations like that, who will admittedly likely also be a minority, should be shut out and ignored if they will pay for something?

What makes the difference between the two is that players who want to hide customization want to take away the value of items available to a potential skin customer, and thus potential sales.

To do this would mean creating a whole different product for such a group, to make sure that each customization that makes it into the game has an option to turn it off as well, and that the option has all the store support to go along with it. This just adds work for the devs for an arguable minority to compete against another arguable minority.

It's also completely in the air on how to price such an option to make it effective and bring everything in the green in terms of money lost/money gained.

Mechzz · 2012-05-06, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

Seems even easier to me not to have any skins that aren immersion breaking.

Hear, hear. I hope this is what most of us want - that the Devs will resist the urge to go all TF2 and Warhammer on us in a game that has to date had a fairly conservative approach to character appearance.

As I mentioned earlier, we haven't seen any evidence the Devs are planning anything crazy. But just in case they do (and who knows what they might do a year or 2 in), I agree it would be good to have an option to turn off the display of certain customisations. in fact, I would want to use it on the current VS Max design, but that's another discussion.

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 12:19 PM

Originally Posted by Mechzz

I would want to use it on the current VS Max design, but that's another discussion.

You and me both. Damn thing looks like a purple butterfly, rather than a death machine.

LostAlgorithm · 2012-05-06, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by Ceska

We had santa hats in Planetside... People liked it.

I realize we had them, and I didn't like them then either. I dealt with them, but I'd have prefered not to have had to unless I specifically felt like seeing people wearing Santa hats shooting at each other. They didn't make any sense in the story of the game, they were just fun items, and while there's nothing wrong with that I simply prefer not having to see them.

What makes the difference between the two is that players who want to hide customization want to take away the enjoyment from a potential skin customer, and thus potential sales.

To do this would mean creating a whole different product for such a group, to make sure that each customization that makes it into the game has an option to turn it off as well, and that the option has all the store support to go along with it. This just adds work for the devs for an arguable minority.

It's also completely in the air on how to price such an option to make it effective and bring everything even in terms of money lost/money gained.

I don't want to take anyone's enjoyment away. They won't know that I can't see the skin they are using, and unless someone goes around screaming about how they can't see a particular skin, no one will ever know. As a result, I fail to see how it affects their enjoyment. Most of the people who buy skins simply won't care.

Again, I'm not going to argue technical details. Yes, it would cause more work, but players do like this kind of control. If one person is willing to pay it, I can guarantee you they're not alone. Pricing simply depends on how much skins will be in the first place, which I'm expecting the majority to be no more than a dollar or two. As such I think somewhere between $10 - $15 is entirely fair for such a feature, and I'd certainly be willing to pay it. So long as it lets you pick and choose, it remains relevant even to those who do like some customizations as well, and price like that seems very appealing for that control.

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 12:36 PM

Originally Posted by LostAlgorithm

I don't want to take anyone's enjoyment away.

But you are. I pay 20$ for a skin for you to see. You pay 10$ to not see it. You have made my 20$ worthless, so I just won't buy another skin.

Mechzz · 2012-05-06, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by ArmedZealot

I pay 20$ for a skin for you to see. You pay 10$ to not see it. You have made my 20$ worthless, so I just won't buy another skin.

I don't understand how the player who bought the skin would know that the player who didn't want to see it didn't see it?

ArmedZealot · 2012-05-06, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Mechzz

I don't understand how the player who bought the skin would know that the player who didn't want to see it didn't see it?

It's not that they don't know that they can't see it. It is that they know they could potentially not see it. It would make me think twice about paying 20$ in the first place.