Exploiting for the win - Page 2

KIAsan · 2004-10-24, 03:24 PM

I don't agree with poor TR leadership on Emerald comment. I was there at the start of day 2, we had initial success. Later, we started to notice a terrible trend, we would have an excellant setup, only to watch VS flood into the continent, then overtake the population, then wipe us and the NC out. It only took this happening 3 times (and watching the total pop suddenly drop as the 4th empire went VS), before I got disgusted, our outfit got disgusted, and many in our alliance too. We all just tuned out at that point and quit caring (I know many just quit). Hell, it just wasn't fun to see that many people on TR, work together to get a plan, set it up, only to have the hoard of VS sweep in and blow it. It got to the point, that the only way for TR or NC to get a crystal, was for the other guy to hit the VS. And half the time, this didn't work either when they had anywhere from 35 - 45 percent population of a 3 WAY POP LOCK.

Now, after this crap started, everyone got discouraged and it became completely disorganized. I know of many of us who appealed the situation, with quick replies from CSR-s who agreed that it was a problem and was being looked at. The disappointment I have, is that they acknowledge the explotation, but won't even level the playing field. So, unless we also exploit, we can't win. What kind of precedent does that set? It's ok to exploit, as long as everyone else is doing it?

I'm just disappointed at SOE. If they had moved in early, they could have stopped this. But, now the results will be tainted and 2/3rds of the player base pissed off. Oh well, what can I say, it's what I have come to expect from SOE.

Rbstr · 2004-10-24, 04:04 PM

ANd morkov i havent seen any problems with it.

It was so cool today, on markov, we were going after Cyssor, and we grabed two subcapitols (the rest was TR) we grabed faro, and eveyone tehre grabed a lightning, talk about blitzlkrieg.

there were 25+ of and we all rolled up to gukunu at once, absolutely steemrolled the entrenched TR. The lighting 3.0 owns, i went 28-2 by using it my first two lives

kcirreda · 2004-10-24, 05:46 PM

Yep, get 4+ Lightnings and see wat can challenge U then. the 12 mm for AA, and the cannon for AT and AI. Just remember to use numbers for it.

As for the exploit, I didnt even nottice. I allways thought a Empire can have 40% pop of a cont MAX (if they was there and poplocked B4 another empire got there) and the 60% was divided among the other 2 empires if they got thre equally. Correct me if Iam wrong.

Warborn · 2004-10-24, 06:04 PM

Originally Posted by KIAsan

I don't agree with poor TR leadership on Emerald comment. I was there at the start of day 2, we had initial success. Later, we started to notice a terrible trend, we would have an excellant setup, only to watch VS flood into the continent, then overtake the population, then wipe us and the NC out.

I was there for most of Saturday, and Friday. On Friday, yes, we had a few good setups. On Saturday the only good setup was on Forseral, the third or fourth monolith, where the VS somehow capped an LLU base instantaneously. Apart from that, no CR5's were making an effort to inform people of the next target, and people would only start calling for people to go to the monolith continent once it was already neutral. Many times I would run to a warpgate, see swarms of VS waiting to go in, and once I zone in, see the TR have 90+ slots left, and something like 15% population compared to 40% for the NC and similar population for the VS. We dragged our feet time after time and never even got a respectable foothold on the continents. Ceryshen, Cyssor, Solsar and others were places that I can remember vividly how the entire continent was being hacked by the NC and VS while the TR zerged from a tower somewhere.

So no, I'd say the exploiting aside, it's really not that unusual that we're doing so badly. The VS obviously wanted to win a lot more than we did.

MrPaul · 2004-10-24, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by kcirreda

I allways thought a Empire can have 40% pop of a cont MAX (if they was there and poplocked B4 another empire got there) and the 60% was divided among the other 2 empires if they got thre equally. Correct me if Iam wrong.

I dunno if it still is, but is used to be *just over* 50%. The Devs only ever said *just over* and didnt give an exact number for reasons I still don't get.

Boomer · 2004-10-24, 08:19 PM

this exploit is so easy to do.. and they didnt fix it. I used it today. It really isnt bad.

the BUG that is letting them all in is when one person leaves continent.. and people are waiting in a WG.. everyone gets in. this can mean 50 vehicles get in all of the sudden. this is part of it.. the other part is the exploit. Getting back into the continent that is locked. figure the rest out.

Anyway... stop whining.. I dont mean to praise the barneys.. but if they can do it.. you can do it too. Too bad the TR high command DOES suck. 30% of the reason the Enclave quit planetside. Otherwise.. maybe you could organize a raid and use the bug to get in. TR markov has done it with me, so has NC markov, NC emerald, and on one occasion TR emerald.

FearTheAtlas · 2004-10-24, 08:37 PM

The issue is that TR high-command don't feel like being bitches and using the glitch, they rather fight clean.

KIAsan · 2004-10-24, 09:21 PM

Hmm, correct me if I was wrong, but the TR was in second place on emerald at the end of day 2. Guess the NC sucked more?

And there were three exploits being used by VS as part of an organized effort (2 population exploits and 1 hacking exploit). The devs have already admitted they are exploits and are going to fix them later.

At this point, it's academic, since the event is over. The problem for the future is the precedent SOE set this time: If one side discover's a game flaw, that allows them a significant advantage, they should all use it (and advertise it in sanctuary). Thats because SOE won't take action against large populations. Good lesson to learn. From now on, I'm not reporting these things, I'm going to train others how to use them. First on my list, how to repair vehicles without being exposed to enemy fire. Lessons start in sanctuary for TR-E every time I'm online.

Firefly · 2004-10-25, 12:02 AM

Originally Posted by Boomer

Anyway... stop whining.. I dont mean to praise the barneys.. but if they can do it.. you can do it too.

I could, if I wanted to earn my battles with cheap easy kills. I neither glitch, nor exploit, nor cheat, nor spawn camp, nor weapons-spam, nor kill-whore. I fight my battles the way I want, and if my code of ethics says I don't cheat to do it, then who the hell are you to tell me what I should do?

Make no mistake about it - I don't care about being beaten. Otherwise I'd be a fourth-empire sellout. I don't mind losing, which is why I play TR exclusively. I don't mind being smeared across the field - provided it's done honorably and without a bunch of underhanded glitching, exploiting, and/or cheating. And I've got a Size Twelve steel-toed Doc Martin for the ass of anyone that thinks I used this exploit.

Originally Posted by Boomer

Too bad the TR high command DOES suck. 30% of the reason the Enclave quit planetside.

I don't give a rat's ass about Enclave. TR is not The Enclave, and The Enclave is not the only outfit in TR. Just as NC Markov is not the 666th and the 666th is not the only NC Markov outfit. Quite frankly, I'm a little irritated at having been compared to an outfit whose leadership style consists of screaming and yelling and threatening and TK'ing, and whose "major players" and personalities among the command group had personal attitudes and personalities which consisted of homophobes, racists, anti-Semites, and other assorted ignorance. I don't care what they accomplished as NC, I don't care what they accomplished as TR the two times they played. Whatever they did on the field was disgraced by their conduct off the field, as well as the other bullshit they did on the field; their attitudes toward the rest of TR pretty much meant that you either stooped to that immaturity (meaning you think "Dude Where's My Car" is an Oscar-worthy masterpiece and "American History X" is the greatest movie in the world as it represents the white struggle), or you were put off by the senior members of their command. For every guy who liked their outfit, there were five more that either remembered them as the NC's MVP *while* they were TR the first time, or they were made to suffer the idiotic antics of a bunch of sophomoric juveniles.

I scoff at the notion of TR's "High Command". There are several distinct camps within the TR upper-CR levels, as near as I can determine (no offense to anyone who does or does not fit into one of these three groups, except maybe the first one). You follow one of three philosophies - one, you're a 15-year old dipship wanna-be Rambo who couldn't lead an army of ants and feels the need to make retarded calls with a platoon of fellow retards at your side backing you up (aka the /global gang-up)... two, you're in the KAAOS-sponsored CR4/CR5/OL discussion group (aka team long-winded, shout-out fellaaaaz!) or associated with the members of that strategy group, or you're in ULTRA. Aside from that, there are few other "groups", and two of those groups are VERY together. If that's sucking, then you must have an army of love-children of Stephen Hawking and George Patton.

Which doesn't explain why you yellow-wearing sissies came in dead LAST for the monolith event. I guess your NC high command was all on a corporate picnic, hmm? Then again, I wonder what that says about the average NC player that isn't a part of the NC high command. That you're a bunch of lemmings that couldn't fight their way out of a wet paper bag without some head honchos holding your hands or shooting at you from behind a la "Enemy At The Gates", I reckon? Yes, you're so much more superior than we poor TR. At least on Markov they have the excuse that a majority of the NC's commanders are actually all in one outfit - so what lame excuse might the NC have for their subpar disgraceful performance this weekend? Wait, I don't care.

Originally Posted by Boomer

Otherwise.. maybe you could organize a raid and use the bug to get in. TR markov has done it with me, so has NC markov, NC emerald, and on one occasion TR emerald.

We had several raids today (Sunday), because I took part in some, and/or led some of them. I counted three successive TR monolith-snaggings during that time period, during which time there were no NC monoliths of blue and yellow hippy-loving. And the funny thing was, to the best of my knowledge there were no glitch-using exploits, and the group I ran with fielded at least 100 coordinated players.

But then again, this is coming from the same empire that said they possessed skill, but screamed bloody murder when surgile was taken away and the Jackhammer was "fixed". All that hype about skill and then suddenly when you're brought within standards, you suddenly cry about the nerf? Hmmm... so I'm supposed to automatically give credence to your "let's cheat!" theory? Simply because the empire you play for is obviously far superior to mine? Sounds like what we've got here is a case of "Do what I do because that's how we have to get ahead in life."

No thanks - it is just a game, but I live by a code of ethics that includes honor and integrity, and that's at the core of who I am, game or not. No thanks, I'll *EARN* my keep the honest way.

Have a nice day.

SquishyWaffle · 2004-10-25, 12:07 AM

Blast those VS, they beat us! Therefore they cheated.

As if the other empires weren't abusing the very same glitches if everyone seems to know about them anyway. I don't condone cheating but don't stick your nubby finger at VS when your own kind were doing the same thing.

Warborn · 2004-10-25, 12:29 AM

Originally Posted by KIAsan

Hmm, correct me if I was wrong, but the TR was in second place on emerald at the end of day 2. Guess the NC sucked more?

Yeah. It's as if the NC didn't even know there was an event going on half the time. They, like us, showed up late a hell of a lot and often didn't even get a foothold (also like us at times). But the topic of discussion isn't the NC, it's the TR, so really, I think the performance of the NC is beside the point.

Though I will at least say that the rampant cheating sullied the entire thing, and I don't believe the results are at all indicative of what each side could have achieved.

nosferatu2323 · 2004-10-25, 01:32 AM

When is that 4th empire glitch gonna get fixed?

NeoPhoenixTE · 2004-10-25, 02:32 AM

For the first two days, there is no question about the VS' use of the bind exploit. People from both TR and NC have seen it, and have submitted screens of it. How big of an effect this had on the monolith competition is obviously being debated, but my two cents say it was alot.

Am I condemning the VS commands strategical abilities? No. I've seen some killer tactics come out in an even fight. Am I blaming the VS as a whole? No. There was a select group using the bind exploit (I Could name an outfit that's high on the list of suspects, but it mighta only been somethin like a random 22 guys or so) while there were alot of VS just showing up for the fight early and being there legitimately. It's the select group that needs to be looked at for this.

Could the TR/NC have come out on top despite this advantage?

With how high a percentage advantage the VS had achieved, I'm going to have to say no. No amount of strategy can overcome a 7-10% population advantage. The zerg would just be too much to handle.

People from both TR and NC (I'm hesitant to speculate that any VS did it) submitted appeals to the CSRs about this exploit, and an answer was given.

The devs obviously scrambled to make a fix to this bug (which is why alot of people get "target cont is full" errors when trying to respawn at sanc after binding somewhere, it's still a lil buggy), and I applaud their swiftness to a solution that stopped this exploit from happenning on Sunday. However, it came as too little too late. This competition showed a rather unplesant side to the VS that has left my respect for that empire shaken significantly.

If those that exploited came forward and confessed, then a simple punishment of those inidividuals (no BFR imprinting during the two weeks, period) would make it better in my book. It takes too many resources to redo an event like this, reguardless of how many complaints were given.

The VS lived up to their legacy of "technology = might" this weekend. Sadly, it was in the form of exploiting existing technology to gain an unfair advantage in an otherwise awesome event. Kinda ironic, wouldn't you say?

Rei · 2004-10-25, 07:01 AM

While some people had gotten through useing the Module feature, what really bolstered VS forces was the fact that the servers will allow everyone in a continent specific WG to gate through when one player leaves the target continent. And the VS were willing to sit and wait in those gates. It wasn't so much an organised effort as just a bunch of people who wanted to play in the event. But I think some people are being selective in their memory of things. While I don't have a screenie of the Map page ( I crashed... AGAIN) soon after I took the shot. But the TR definately had 50% pop on Forseral to the VS 32% (poplock) and the NC 31%. The devs need to address the issue of WG's gating everyone when one place opens.

Firefly · 2004-10-25, 08:07 AM

Originally Posted by Rei

The devs need to address the issue of WG's gating everyone when one place opens.

That's the problem there. That, and the module exploit. Funny how they don't seem to know a fix, yet we've known about the one-slot trick for how long? Months?

I'm listening to Morbid Angel and it rocks, as ever. Just thought I'd share that.