something absent from the AGN and the E3 stream (melee)

[MrMorton]

I think the melee cannot kill in one hit with the exception of maybe an inf.

in the stream I remember seeing a max hit a light class and the light class not dying instantly.

however there was a cert on inf for something along the lines of 'melee power booster' that I assume increases melee damage.

[megamold]

Originally Posted by whymad

*SIGH* Why is that SOE has to be like every other fps devs? Why can't they just listen to us, and not implement crap features like quick knife. Battlefield Auraxis anybody? :/

obvious troll is obvious.

we allready voiced our concern about quickknife ( meaning : instakill knifing) a long time ago and i'm pretty sure they listened to us since there would be much more knifing going on in the E3 demo if they went with CoD style knifing.

and even when they showed the knife for the first time we had no indication if it would be a 1hit kill type of deal only that you could pull it with the press of a button wich is ok in my opinion.

[Eyeklops]

Originally Posted by whymad

*SIGH* Why is that SOE has to be like every other fps devs? Why can't they just listen to us, and not implement crap features like quick knife. Battlefield Auraxis anybody? :/

I like the BF3 knife, it's well balanced. The only time I ever get killed with it is from behind. The BF3 knife is NOT the leaping blade of death that BC2 and COD have.

[Turdicus]

If someone has to pump 5 or 6 certifications into a particular class to get a 1 hit kill knife thats fine. It's a lot of effort for very little reward. If an infiltrator is able to kill 1 guy at a time its not too different from getting blasted away by a shotgun or an smg at point blank (near instadeath anyway). It doesn't seem any more efficient than if he had pumped 5 or 6 certifications into a shotgun to achieve vert short ttk.

[Cuross]

Originally Posted by Turdicus

Hm, haven't you ever seen a tactical vest with a knife holster on the hip or on the chest? When it is on the chest the knife handle is pointed down so the user can very quickly pull it out and thrust in as short a time as possible. Designed for lightning strikes. Maybe your soldier just holds his rifle with his left hand while he unsheathes and swipes with the knife in his right. Doesn't seem very far fetched to me.

I have seen this, I have studied it, and I have even tried to perform it (not with a real blade, of course, but I do have training in wielding knives). The one thing that I can't get over is how quick the attack is, then all of a sudden it's back in the sheath? Doesn't matter damage or frequency, it still seems tacky to me even for a game. Plus! Unless the blade is formed out of nanites at the moment they strike, I haven't seen a knife sheath on the soldier's uniform anywhere, haha. Now, if they made the quick melee something like the punching dagger from Star Wars: Republic Commando--....

[Wayside]

Originally Posted by megamold

so i just watched the latest AGN recording and i saw the 3 days or TB's E3 stream.

one thing i could not see in the stream were people using knives, this to me is possibly a positive indication because if it was a stream of the new CoD everyone would be knifing like crazy. so it tells me its not overpowered.
also on a related note : the melee system for maxes

now since this was such a big deal a couple weeks ago ( and rightly so ) i was sure it would be discussed on the AGN, to my surprise it wasnt.

so does this mean its not overpowered, and they went with a good system?
does this mean it wasnt funtional for E3 ?
or does this mean that everyone just forgot about it

Given what gameplay we've been shown thus far, I suspect melee is only going to be effective for infiltrators who can approach enemies relatively unseen, and MAXs who can approach enemies with relative impunity.

Anyone else is likely to favor a ranged weapon over melee, with the exception of those moments where they round a corner and are faced with an enemy within arms reach who is currently distracted or facing away from them.

[megamold]

Originally Posted by Eyeklops

I like the BF3 knife, it's well balanced. The only time I ever get killed with it is from behind. The BF3 knife is NOT the leaping blade of death that BC2 and COD have.

i think its a great system to, it rewards the sneakyer players or the more tactical players while giving the others a "last resort" attack that is only mildly effective

[therandomone]

Why so much hate for the knife? I agree you shouldnt be able to lunge from 10ft away but no one hit kill? Clearly no one here knows how to use a blade properly. I can easily think of ways to stop a man dead in his tracks, hell with a decent size blade you can kill a man before his body hits the floor. Now devs dont always use the right animations,but realistically it is possible.

[GreatMazinkaise]

Originally Posted by therandomone

Why so much hate for the knife? I agree you shouldnt be able to lunge from 10ft away but no one hit kill? Clearly no one here knows how to use a blade properly. I can easily think of ways to stop a man dead in his tracks, hell with a decent size blade you can kill a man before his body hits the floor. Now devs dont always use the right animations,but realistically it is possible.

Well, it's a First Person Shooter, if you want to kill someone you should, well, Shoot Them!

I did notice that in the animations the knife wielders appeared to be holding them Psycho-style instead of actually wielding them which just looked odd. The best knifers should be looking for is a two-hit kill on armored infantry, and that should require significant investment in the melee booster cert.

[megamold]

Originally Posted by therandomone

Why so much hate for the knife? I agree you shouldnt be able to lunge from 10ft away but no one hit kill? Clearly no one here knows how to use a blade properly. I can easily think of ways to stop a man dead in his tracks, hell with a decent size blade you can kill a man before his body hits the floor. Now devs dont always use the right animations,but realistically it is possible.

so in a situation where you use a knife against a heavy assault fully decked out in nanite armor sporting a gaint chaingun you should win ?

if you managed to sneak up on one and slit his throat then sure i can get behind that
winning a full on frontal attack with a knife versus a guy with a gun is just crazy imho

[Neurotoxin]

Its a fairly rapid action. I couldn't go from firing to quick knife back to firing without a short delay, but that is how it should be. I never hit anyone with it, so unfortunately I can't speak to the damage it inflicts.

For a knife-oriented infiltrator (remember - can't attack while in cloaking now) I'm not sure how it'll be. Unless there's a special cloaking module that allows for meleeing to not break the cloak, it'll be hard to run around like a fully invisible ninja and expect to get kills.

Maybe they'll have melee combo attacks, mash F or hold F to keep swinging?

[therandomone]

Originally Posted by GreatMazinkaise

Well, it's a First Person Shooter, if you want to kill someone you should, well, Shoot Them!

I did notice that in the animations the knife wielders appeared to be holding them Psycho-style instead of actually wielding them which just looked odd. The best knifers should be looking for is a two-hit kill on armored infantry, and that should require significant investment in the melee booster cert.

Hey now, that sarcasm was just mean . I agree though, I'm not going to run around in an open field trying to knife people then bitch about why I die so often because generally your best case is to shoot the living shit out of them. All I'm saying is if I'm coming up behind you I knife you in the back of the skull and hit your brain stem causing you to lose all motor function and stopping even basic functions like breathing-causing death. From the front I'll either (depending on the exact size of the blade) come down through the top of the shoulder and pierce the heart (a favorite of the Romans in Gladiator executions because if done correctly it would kill the man before he hit the ground) or just go through the space in a rib cage and stab the heart directly (which means you only have about a 33% chance of survival if you get immediate care).

Actually, typing that last sentence makes me think they should add a bleed out mechanic with the knife as a compromise of sorts. That way anyone who is knifed has a chance at being revived, otherwise they bleed out at die. Does that seem more fair?

Edit: Also, todays day and age bullet proof vests will (hopefully, but not always the case) do just that stop bullets. Sure as hell wont stop a blade though. So, if we're arguing that the armor has become technologically advance, how can you not make the logical conclusion that the knife has as well (i.e. diamond knives).
Also, if I (or anyone else for that matter) get in close range, a gun isn't worth squat.

[elsnakeo]

Maybe one hit kills from a MAX, considering they're powerfully built robotic suits. There's always the Halo: Reach system of being a one hit if their shields are down- people seemed not to be able to soak up many bullets to begin with so it probably wouldn't be too overpowered in my opinion.

[megamold]

Originally Posted by Neurotoxin

Its a fairly rapid action. I couldn't go from firing to quick knife back to firing without a short delay, but that is how it should be. I never hit anyone with it, so unfortunately I can't speak to the damage it inflicts.

For a knife-oriented infiltrator (remember - can't attack while in cloaking now) I'm not sure how it'll be. Unless there's a special cloaking module that allows for meleeing to not break the cloak, it'll be hard to run around like a fully invisible ninja and expect to get kills.

Maybe they'll have melee combo attacks, mash F or hold F to keep swinging?

this is what i was waiting for from my original post.
thanks for the info, including all the pics from the ps2 station at E3

[Mastachief]

Originally Posted by Mirror

seeing the quick knife made me die a little inside

Me too MAN! Me too.