Vehicle Change Idea

[Beerbeer]

I'll be honest, I farm infantry in vehicles as much as any other person, maybe more so. But I can see where it's becoming detrimental to the fundamental core of the game. There are less and less infantry roaming the world.

I realized this when I started to pay attention to base takeovers. Most of the people were in vehicles, jockeying for position to camp the few defenders left. One person stood at the control point. Even more astounding, I've witnessed base attacks where no one would get out of their vehicles to cap. I couldn't believe it as this is what the game has become.

1. Infantry activities are severely limited. The only purpose of infantry is to flip the objective and get farmed.
2. There's really no point in buying infantry weapons IMO, if everyone ultimately ends up using vehicles to farm an ever-shrinking pool of infantry players.
3. One-shotting anything is cheap and requires no skill, and therein lies the problem with vehicles IMO.

[CasualCat]

Originally Posted by Beerbeer

One person stood at the control point. Even more astounding, I've witnessed base attacks where no one would get out of their vehicles to cap. I couldn't believe it as this is what the game has become.

I have a feeling this has some to do with the interaction of vehicle despawn timers/rear armor weakness/spawn timers/resources.

They get out of their vehicle, depending on the cap time they could lose it to despawn, enemy fire, etc.

[Whiteagle]

Well as Figment has been going on about over here, the bigger issue is the base designs themselves...

To quote his huge defense write-up:

Originally Posted by Figment

B. A base can only be taken by firm infantry control. Vehicles gain ground, infantry consolidate terrain.

Clearly, this isn't the case with the current base layouts.

[Beerbeer]

You're kind of missing the point, but you highlight the issue nonetheless (in reference to cat).

What's sad is that the game, in this state, will never attract newbies in the magnitude they want. Newbies thinking this game is a fairly traditional "FPS" game in the sense of the word, will get steamrolled by a mass of vehicles. Coupled with the generally confusing game elements and poor explanations of anything, population may have peaked and now shrinking.

The only people left are the vehicle one-shot campers, while the pool of people to camp shrinks.

[WarbirdTD]

As has been said before, the main problem is not vehicles, so nerfing them isn't the right course. The right course is a complete redesign of the major bases so that the spawn room is underground and deep inside the main base. Vehicles should NEVER EVER be able to spam at infantry running from their spawn to regain a control point. This makes for base defense that not only doesn't make any sense, but is also hugely frustrating. Looking at some of Figment's drawings and posts, I think they should probably hire him as a consultant.

[Beerbeer]

I still believe these powerful one-man vehicles need addressing, in either how often they can be acquired or eliminating their one-shot, easy-mode capability.

It's like those great hunters that hunt their prey into extinction. Then the hunters quit.

[NtrSandman]

Take the main gun away from the driver, give it back to the passenger. I think that would be fewer tanks on the road because people would be less likely to run a tank by themselves if they have no/weak gun. I see about half of the tanks with only one person in them. I think this change would take 25%-33% of the tanks off the road.

[Beerbeer]

Agree.

[The Messenger]

It's pretty rediculous to see a column of vehicles just staring at the external shields at an AMP station waiting for someone else to take the shield down. I tend to make a habit of not destroying gens if I think we can take the base without their help. Unfortunately some indy n00blet wants the points for destroying the gens and the tanks eventually get in.

Nerfing vehicles is also a really bad idea because then they would have to nerf C4, AT Mines, and maybe rockets just to compensate. It wouldn't be right to leave tanks to be almost defenseless against infantry. Tanks are easy to kill, just sneak up on them with AT mines or a buddy with rockets to the rear. And if they spot you, use cover to get away.

The resource system does need a serious revamp though. And dedicated drivers would've cut the tanks down by about half. Drivers would probably have preferred gunners; kicking out indies and n00blets trying to farm easy kills.

Then again I don't know how they'd work dedicated drivers for lightnings and especially the magrider. A magrider's driver sitting on a hill would be bored out of his mind. But it would make tank combat more interesting for prowlers and vannies.

[Beerbeer]

Putting one-man, one-shot insta-gib vehicles in the game, that can be pretty much be driven at will, was a mistake as they will naturally overshadow everything else.

Rocket pods got a decent nerf. Tanks are next. It's either that or make them rarer IMO.

You can look at it from either side: people who believe one-man tanks should insta-gib infantry should sit on the rarer side. Those that don't should sit on the reduced damaged side. It's either that or make them two-man vehicles where the driver just drives.

[GLaDOS]

Giving the gunner the main gun won't help. That will just cause tankers to ask for buffs, since they've become a three-man vehicle, which means we'll have less tanks, but they'll be more powerful. Access needs to be limited, although I won't pretend I know how.

[Beerbeer]

If you think about it, tanks, especially with HE guns and zoom optics, are like libs, but don't require a gunner.

[The Messenger]

Rank up FLAK armor, I've put HE rounds right next to infantry and not OHK. Either it's buggy or they have REALLY high FLAK.

[Beerbeer]

I really don't play infantry much anymore to worry about that.