Oh, The Velocity! - Page 2

Dragonskin · 2013-07-10, 09:51 AM

Personally, I like the Lynx the most out of the carbines for TR. I don't play Light Assault.. but I do usually play CQC when I play my Engineer and the Lynx is awesome. Usually end up using the Lynx over the Hailstorm. In longer range combat I like the TRAC-5 S... also nice that it can use underbarrels.

All of the carbines seem to under perform when compared to Assault Rifles in my opinion. I just don't like playing Medic very often... maybe I need to get C4 and then I can feel better about not having explosives...hmm.

Going to add this since the T5 AMC has been brought up. Wrel did a in depth review of it recently.

Canaris · 2013-07-10, 11:49 AM

can't say I'm having that trouble mate, loved my Trac5-S working my way through the Jag & AMC atm, both very solid guns even without the n00btube

I just picked up the Lynx as it was on sale the other day from what my fellow LA's tell me it's also a beast.

Palerion · 2013-07-10, 01:25 PM

I'll admit I have no trouble with the Trac-5 S, default Trac, or the T5 AMC; those are out of the question, but I prefer higher fire rates, especially since I generally prefer to kill Heavy Assaults. You know, having a high fire rate, like 845 rpm, when an HA can only afford 750 at max, helps counter their shield a bit.

The slow fire rate TR guns actually have fine velocity (and recoil) in my opinion, it's just that the high fire rate ones generally suck in one or both areas. If you use them like an SMG and just hipfire, you're fine I guess, but at that point I feel like you're better off with an smg or, of course, a shotgun. Just saying that there isn't exactly a VX6-7 or GD7-F kind of option for the TR, and the lynx seems to be strictly hip-fire oriented. I know carbines tend to lean that way, but again, there are better options if you're just hip-firing, so your carbine needs some viable mid-range (ADS) capabilities.

diLLa · 2013-07-10, 02:39 PM

Originally Posted by Palerion

Failed attempt to not sound like an asshole. Good try :P

People picking apart my stats to prove a point gets kind of old; might as well just remove my sig.

I don't care about my stats; half the time in-game I'm just goofing off. Experimenting in VR arena, if I'm in combat I don't try too hard because I just don't find it rewarding.

And of all stats to point out: kill/death? Unless you're a tryhard, you probably don't care about that statistic at all.

Back on topic. I do have VS and NC characters, mind you, and have thoroughly tested their weapons in the VR before positing this. Also worth noting, I only posted this after confirming it with other players and observing similar complaints in other threads. I'm just suggesting that maybe these carbines fall short in a few too many areas (velocity, recoil, COF) to make them very effective whatsoever.

If there is one thing I've learned over the years when it comes to balance in competitive games (especially when I was playing Starcraft 2), it is that balance is only of worth when played on the highest level of play. You claim that our TR equipment suffers because of ridiciolous recoil and bad velocity. I claim by talking about your "meaningless" stats (which I deem indicative of a person's skill, not conclusive, but indicative), that you are in no position to complain about these things.

It's really easy to complain about balance being the reason you fail, same as your "dicking around" argument being the reason of your low score/min. If you really don't give a shit, then don't start these pointless threads. If you do give a shit though, I recommend you to start looking at your personal skill and come back when you've mastered the game's gunplay, only then you can talk about balance issues.

On the team liquid forums (main starcraft 2 forums) you would get banned for starting a thread like this..

Palerion · 2013-07-10, 03:30 PM

Why would I get banned for starting a thread like this? I proposed a relatively valid point, whether or not you think so. I didn't want someone to start a conflict in this thread, but of course someone had to go on the offensive. And by saying that I'm not trying to target you, it just frustrates me when this sort of more personal attack comes out in a thread, instead of understanding and simple helpful advice.

I'm doing testing as we speak, both with VR and weapon trials, and I do give a shit, contrary to what you may believe. When I'm having casual fun with my friends late at night (or, rather, early in the morning), though, I'm not at my best. And with my schedule, sometimes that casual fun with friends is all I have time for. I had a spare hour today to really give it my all and went a steady 4.0 k/d as light assault with some pretty good score per minute, 53 certs in 40 minutes.

It's not like I posted this thread with no knowledge and no attempt at exploring prior to the posting. I checked my facts and figured it was worth posting. Our high rate of fire options do suffer from low velocity and\or some rough recoil in comparison to the other factions. I just wanted to see if anyone else was having a similar experience.

diLLa · 2013-07-10, 03:54 PM

You would get banned, because you question gamebalance, while being (as you say it yourself) a casual player. There is no such thing as balance issues when you play as a casual. Although your thread is more civilized and thought through than most, it's still a balance whine post, just like any other a lot of bad players like to create.

Palerion · 2013-07-10, 04:10 PM

Alright, I'll accept that, but this isn't Starcraft. And why does it seem you have singled out this thread, which apparently is more civil and thought out, to criticize? I haven't asked for a buff, I'm just wondering if anyone else has felt the velocity and recoil to be as hindering (NOT that I can't still do well with them) as I have on the higher fire rate TR carbines.

It was less a complaint, moreso a request for people to experiment with the weapons, as I have been doing, and respond with their results.

diLLa · 2013-07-10, 04:20 PM

Your opening post sounds like a complaint, but then packaged in a nice way. The truth in my opinion is, that the guns are all fine. The recoil in this game is incredibly easy to control compared to most older games (older as in pre-call of duty 4, which is stupidly easy and somehow deemed the new standard for a lot of new games).

I understand that you could have trouble with velocity, but that's one of the traits of having a carbine. If you want an easier time with controlling for velocity and control of weapon, then switch to a T1 Cycler medic setup.

For TR having the worst velocity, hardly a balance issue. Our weaponry seems fine overall, and there is enough choices for you to pick.

Goliith · 2013-07-10, 08:23 PM

I would suggest trying out the mentioned T5 AMC setup with compensator, Adv. Foregrip, and preferably (For myself) the 2x Reflex site, with High Velocity ammo.

It was my go to weapon for a long while, and I still like it, I just dont use it as much as I now have loadouts for much more niche situations (SMG, Shotgun, AMR-66) for the 3 primary engagement ranges. Though I also have an T5 AMC Loadout, as the gun performs exceptionally at ranges beyond extreme CQC.

I play Engineer is my primary and almost ONLY class with 300hrs or more in that class alone, and I feel carbines do great at their niche role, inferior to ARs and Shotguns/SMGs at THEIR niche roles, but quite great in their designed encounter distance.

I personally feel VS weapons and NC weapons both handle like greased shit, but I am biased as I played both factions before of those factions before getting their gunplay fixed.

I would also like to make a small side note, that I play casually most of the time, spending 10-30+ minutes in the VR a week, and often end up rolling about as an ammo/repair bitch to make up for all the terrible engineers in the world, and I still have no issue maintaining an average 1.66K/D and 431.8 SPM. I often am the guy doing Suicide runs into rooms full of people to initiate that charge of scared folks that stand outside doors for 5 minutes.

I am not saying this to claim some form of elite status or say your stats mean you cannot play the game well, I am merely listing my stats along with my opinion that the TR weapons all feel quite fine in their separate roles to myself individually.

Palerion · 2013-07-10, 11:07 PM

Well, again, my stats do hardly reflect how I play now. I have stats that drag me down from when I was still learning. Not to mention 400+ SPM when i've done LA for almost my entire PS2 career is kind of hard.

But, Goliith, I do like the AMC

I just prefer more fire rate. Maybe when (if) the TR gets its 845+ rpm carbine, it will perform more like a GD7 or VX6-7 (which is 800 rpm, I know).

SternLX · 2013-07-11, 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by Goliith

I would suggest trying out the mentioned T5 AMC setup with compensator, Adv. Foregrip, and preferably (For myself) the 2x Reflex site, with High Velocity ammo.

Exactly how I run the T5 AMC on my TR alt.
It's also that same setup I run on my Main and Fav Carbine on VS. The Pulsar C. I'm one of the very few that love that Carbine and do quite well with it.

Pella · 2013-07-11, 02:05 AM

Wrel Makes a Gun video, it becomes Flavor of the month.

I have Aurxium medals for most carbines. And the Trac 5 is still arguably the best across 3 factions.

That being said, You need to understand the recoil of most guns, And learn the best kill range to understand what your talking about.

Wrels video's are good for an overview. But are misleading to people who understand gunplay.

AThreatToYou · 2013-07-11, 07:17 AM

Does that re-validate my participation in this discussion, or should I still fuck off?

No, I think you clarified it well enough. Wait, is that no or yes? What?
Okay, uhh, it's like asking "am I wrong or right?" and someone says yes. That would mean I say yes?

Dragonskin · 2013-07-11, 08:25 AM

Originally Posted by Pella

Wrel Makes a Gun video, it becomes Flavor of the month.

I have Aurxium medals for most carbines. And the Trac 5 is still arguably the best across 3 factions.

That being said, You need to understand the recoil of most guns, And learn the best kill range to understand what your talking about.

Wrels video's are good for an overview. But are misleading to people who understand gunplay.

Right, I just linked Wrel's video to help give clueless people a clue. Unfortunately everyone seems to believe that if Wrel, Drankthekoolaid or levelcap come out with a weapon review then that's the new weapon they are supposed to be using. Levelcap and Wrel have even made remarks in videos to try to stop people from doing that, but it doesn't work. It still becomes the flavor of the month.

For this thread the video applies more because the OP is trying to find a ranged oriented gun instead of a CQC gun which is what the T5 AMC is actually good at doing. The gun doesn't fit my normal playstyle. I prefer CQC oriented primaries with my commisioner to pick off runners or to hit people out of cqc range while closing the distance. The commisioner is a great ranged pistol... even for TR since the repeater in all it's glory sucks at anything outside of close range.

Pella · 2013-07-11, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by Dragonskin

Right, I just linked Wrel's video to help give clueless people a clue. Unfortunately everyone seems to believe that if Wrel, Drankthekoolaid or levelcap come out with a weapon review then that's the new weapon they are supposed to be using. Levelcap and Wrel have even made remarks in videos to try to stop people from doing that, but it doesn't work. It still becomes the flavor of the month.

For this thread the video applies more because the OP is trying to find a ranged oriented gun instead of a CQC gun which is what the T5 AMC is actually good at doing. The gun doesn't fit my normal playstyle. I prefer CQC oriented primaries with my commisioner to pick off runners or to hit people out of cqc range while closing the distance. The commisioner is a great ranged pistol... even for TR since the repeater in all it's glory sucks at anything outside of close range.

True. But like what Dilla said. All weapons are effective and good at killing.
Most people pick up a weapon and expect to dominate with it. Which is possible. But not without a good session playing with it.

Il be doing weapon loadouts video on my channel when i get some time.