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View Poll Results: What do you identify yourself as? | |||
Atheist/Skeptic/Agnostic | 151 | 70.89% | |
Catholic | 21 | 9.86% | |
Protestant | 24 | 11.27% | |
Jewish | 5 | 2.35% | |
Muslim | 2 | 0.94% | |
Philisophy (Such as Buddhism) | 10 | 4.69% | |
Voters: 213. You may not vote on this poll |
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2012-05-01, 10:05 PM | [Ignore Me] #571 | |||
Colonel
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I respect everyone's belief, although I'm not religious myself, as I feel it's a waste of time. |
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2012-05-02, 12:40 AM | [Ignore Me] #573 | |||
Colonel
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There is a difference between not believing in something and having absolutely no reason or evidence to believe in something. Just because its possible doesn't mean its true, or even likely. While it is entirely possible there was a secret nasa mission to deposit a teapot in orbit around the sun between earth and mars, there is zero reason to believe they did this, and zero evidence for it. It is not a 'belief' to state there is no teapot. Do I really have to say I don't believe in Santa Claus? No. There is no Santa Claus. There was probably a Saint Nicholas, but we only know of him because Coca Cola had a marketing campaign. There are no elves. No ents. No dwarves(at least not a race of them in the tolkien sense). No orcs. No fire breathing dragons. No vampires. No smurfs. No honest politicians. No flying reindeer, or elephants, or horses. No unicorns. No gryphons. Nobody is dragging the sun across the sky in a magical chariot. Is it possible that somewhere in the universe some close approximation of some of these exist? Sure. Why not? But if they've existed on earth at any point, there is zero evidence of it. Until there is evidence to the contrary, its not a belief to say these things do not exist. Its a statement of fact. Last edited by CutterJohn; 2012-05-02 at 12:42 AM. |
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2012-05-02, 01:16 AM | [Ignore Me] #574 | |||
Second Lieutenant
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I'm just commenting in this post to qualify the biblical position on what 'faith' is.
In Hebrew: 'aman אָמַן Carries the idea of both mental assent and faithFULness/obeying (like wedding vows) http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/...ngs=H539&t=KJV In Greek: pistis (fem. noun) πίστις Again, carries the idea of both believing and loyalty/faithfulness. http://www.blueletterbible.org/lang/...gs=G4102&t=KJV What biblical faith is NOT is mental assent by itself.
I'm mainly just posting this for the brothers reading this to remember that we need to keep God's commandments as a demonstration and evidence of our *faith*. Peace. |
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2012-05-02, 01:21 AM | [Ignore Me] #575 | |||
First Lieutenant
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Yes, because pointing out flaws in your argument shows how angry I am. |
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2012-05-02, 02:47 AM | [Ignore Me] #576 | ||
Master Sergeant
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I don't know why you're still arguing with these guys Duke.
You can't change peoples' opinions with debate...they think what they want and nothing will change that. Some people need things in their face before they believe it. If you believe in God, and you believe in your religion....they'll get their proof soon enough. I bowed out of this thread a long time ago, because no matter what you say...you don't have scientific proof that God exists...so your words are wasted. Faith is just that....Faith. It doesn't need scientific approval. It's simply something they will never understand...and they will always think it is childish. Let them have their opinions...it should never distract you from your beliefs. If you are a true Christian/Muslim/Buddhist....what have you....then the words of someone who has so little faith that everything has to be proven to them in man's feeble physical terms....shouldn't shake your foundations in the slightest. On the contrary, I pity most people that can't feel the wonderment that faith brings me. I pity those that can't feel the joy I do knowing that there is a God that loves me. And I pity the deaf ears that cry out "Proof! Bring me proof before I can even consider that there is something so loving that it created the universe and everything in it so that a creature as low as I could exist for even a fraction of a time." They will never understand Duke, and they will always look down on the faithful. And maybe it's best that way. Our challenge is to accept their ridicule, and allow it to strengthen our faith. That's all. "But I say unto you, Love your enemies, bless them that curse you, do good to them that hate you, and pray for them which despitefully use you, and persecute you;" Matthew 5:44...right from Christ's mouth. Last edited by WildGunsTomcat; 2012-05-02 at 02:53 AM. |
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2012-05-02, 03:46 AM | [Ignore Me] #577 | ||
Colonel
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If you're a true christian or muslim, you cannot tolerate the others or buddhisms existence. They are fundamentally at odds with core aspects of your faith.
If you're a buddhist, you can't get along with christianity or islam, since, while Buddhists recognize that gods can and may exist, they are irrelevant. The gods are stuck in the same trap of reality as we, seeking nirvana. These, along with the other major religions of Taoism and Hinduism, are all mutually exclusive. You cannot believe in one if you believe in another. By telling all people with such faith to keep their faith, you're saying what you believe in is not important, merely the fact that you have faith. You're making faith itself a religious entity. |
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2012-05-02, 03:58 AM | [Ignore Me] #578 | |||
Lieutenant General
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http://www.planetside-universe.com/s...&postcount=371 Could you take on the challenge and find where the flaw in the logic is? I've never seen a creationist be able to tackle this argument against the existence of deities that interact with humanity. The Abrahamic gods in particular are shown to be false due to his claimed properties (timeless, omnipotence and omnipresence in particular) not being coherent with observational facts. My argument shows that none - and I repeat: NONE - of the world religions past, present or future is true. Last edited by Figment; 2012-05-02 at 04:19 AM. |
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2012-05-02, 07:09 AM | [Ignore Me] #579 | ||
“Do not believe in anything simply because you have heard it. Do not believe in anything simply because it is spoken and rumored by many. Do not believe in anything simply because it is found written in your religious books. Do not believe in anything merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. Do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations. But after observation and analysis, when you find that anything agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it.”
Buddha |
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2012-05-02, 07:48 AM | [Ignore Me] #580 | |||
Second Lieutenant
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It's a perfect example of the strange public perception of 'faith' being something noble, or a positive character trait. It's bizarre because being 'faithful' to religious belief is, from a practical standpoint, nearly identical to being superstitious. And exactly how noble do we view the superstitious in our society? It's silly, more than anything else. The problem is, the "Believe whatever you want, so long as you believe!" opinion is fundamentally flawed, since these beliefs exist exclusive to one another. If you are a christian, then you have to recognize that when Jesus says that the only path to heaven is through him, you have to understand that means all non-christians go to hell. Atheists, muslims, hindus, taoists, shinto, buddhists, all going to hell to burn in agony for all time. You have to accept that. If you don't, you're as much of an apostate as I am, so you really may as well just be atheist. It makes things so much less complicated, and it really frees up your Sundays. |
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2012-05-02, 10:23 AM | [Ignore Me] #581 | ||
Lieutenant General
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I'd just like to see someone take on the challenge I posted seriously once, instead of ignoring and avoiding, the usual reaction to challenges and obstacles by the "faithful". :/
They have so much faith that they dare not test it... |
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2012-05-02, 10:57 AM | [Ignore Me] #582 | |||
Second Lieutenant
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After all, I never thought for a moment that either of them would read one of my posts and smack their foreheads and go "oh my god, I've been wrong all this time". Hardly. I expect they barely read my posts as it is. It's like exercise for the brain. I read their posts and construct rebuttal arguments (or, occasionally, as it was in the monument thread, actually agree with folks of a differing opinion). It's a worthwhile endeavor because debate is how we get towards the truth. Everyone walks away from a debate thinking they were the winner, moral or otherwise. But the debate is important to have, as it gives up perspective on the opinions of our fellow man, and gives us an opportunity to try out our own opinions; to see which ones hold up under scrutiny, and which ones do not. It's "opinion practice". A fun diversion that helps strengthen the headmuscles. I will keep posting as long as they do. If they've realized that they simply lack the ability to defend their position, I'll happily let them go, but I won't give up so long as they stay in the conversation, because boy howdy I'm having the time of my life. |
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2012-05-02, 11:50 AM | [Ignore Me] #585 | |||
Colonel
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Its like the time I finally, after much hemming and hawing, got a rather devoutly christian buddy of mine to admit that his religion required I go to hell. Frankly getting it out of him was like pulling a tooth. Its like saying it was forcing him to acknowledge it in a way he'd never had to before, to realize how fucked up of an idea that really is. Sure its all fine and good to say a murderer is going to hell, but a decent fellow, and a friend at that? I took pity on him and changed the conversation to movie trivia after that, but the conversation always makes me wonder how many really believe it all, deep down, and how many truly understand and accept the ramifications of those beliefs. I think many have a personal interpretation that they make work for them and their world views, and just sort of gloss over and ignore the rest. |
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